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HomeMy WebLinkAboutMinutes 09.18.2019b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) Page 1 CONTRACTOR EXAMINING BOARD AGENDA SEPTEMBER 18, 2019 at 8:30 A.M. ST. LUCIE COUNTY ADMINISTRATION BOARD OF COUNTY COMMISSIONERS COMMISSION CHAMBERS 2300 Virginia Avenue Ft. Pierce, FL 34982 PRESENT: DOUG DAVIS ROGER HUDSPETH II CHRIS LANGEL TONY JERGER MICHAEL PRIDE DENNIS PARKER TRAVIS LEONARD DAN ZRALLACK ABSENT: FRED ROHRBOUGH MICHAEL DIFRANCESCO STAFF PRESENT: DANIELLE WILLIAMS GARY STEPALAVICH KATHERINE BARBIERI MONICA GRAZIANI MICHAEL CICIO ROXANN JOHNSON b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) Page 2 1 AGENDA 2 DESCRIPTION PAGE NO. 3 Call to Order 3 4 Roll Call 3 5 Approval of Minutes 3 6 Swear in Staff Members 4 7 Public Comment 5 8 Applications to be Approved 25 9 Citation Appeal 31 10 Disciplinary Case 46 11 Old Business 92 12 New Business 92 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 3 (Pages 3 to 6) Page 3 1 MR. DAVIS: I'd like to call the contractor's 2 examining board to order. Madam secretary, if you 3 would call the roll, please. 4 MS. JOHNSON: Good morning. Doug Davis? 5 MR. DAVIS: Yes, ma'am. 6 MS. JOHNSON: Fred Rohrbough was excused. 7 Michael DiFrancesco was excused. Roger Hudspeth? 8 MR. HUDSPETH: Yes, ma'am. 9 MS. JOHNSON: Chris Langel? 10 MR. LANGEL: Yes, ma'am. 11 MS. JOHNSON: Tony Jerger? 12 MR. JERGER: Yes, ma'am. 13 MS. JOHNSON: Travis Leonard? 14 MR. LEONARD: Yes, ma'am. 15 MS. JOHNSON: Michael Pride? 16 MR. PRIDE: Yes, ma'am. 17 MS. JOHNSON: Dan Zrallack? 18 MR. ZRALLACK: Yes, ma'am. 19 MS. JOHNSON: Dennis Parker? 20 MR. PARKER: Yes, ma'am. 21 MR. DAVIS: Thank you, Madam Secretary. In 22 our board packet everybody got a copy of our 23 minutes from the last meeting, July 17th, and it 24 didn't take us long to read that said minutes. I 25 hope if anybody found any errors or omissions, Page 4 1 corrections that need to be made, if you would so 2 speak. 3 MR. ZRALLACK: Mr. Chair, the date on the 4 third page for our next meeting -- 5 MR. DAVIS: Okay. Correction? 6 MR. ZRALLACK: It should be today, correct? 7 MR. DAVIS: Yeah. So noted. Any other 8 comments? If not, I'd receive the motion, please. 9 MR. LEONARD: I'd make a motion to approve the 10 minutes based on Mr. Zrallack's comments. 11 MR. HUDSPETH: Second. 12 MR. DAVIS: Motion by Mr. Leonard and a second 13 by Mr. Hudspeth. Any other discussion? All in 14 favor say aye. 15 MULTIPLE VOICES: Aye. 16 MR. DAVIS: Any opposed? Unanimous. Thank 17 you, Madam Secretary. If you'd make that one 18 correction for us. If you will, we'll go ahead and 19 swear in our staff members. 20 MS. JOHNSON: Raise your right hand and state 21 your name for the record. 22 MS. GRAZIANI: Monica Graziani. 23 MR. CICIO: Michael Cicio. 24 MS. WILLIAMS: Danielle Williams. 25 MR. STEPALAVICH: Gary Stepalavich. Page 5 1 MS. JOHNSON: Do you swear or affirm to tell 2 the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the 3 truth? 4 MULTIPLE VOICES: Yes. 5 MS. JOHNSON: Thank you. 6 MR. DAVIS: As typical in our board meetings, 7 we do have a moment in the front for public comment 8 and that way you have an opportunity to speak 9 before you have to wade through our business. You 10 don't have to wade through it with us if you don't 11 want. So we'll do that on the front end. I see we 12 have a big audience today, which I'm just going to 13 forewarn everybody, that's not typical for us as a 14 licensing board so we're a little nervous today, 15 okay? If you do have public comment and you want 16 to spend that time, evidently there's a 17 three-minute limit, and there's a -- I don't know 18 what you'd call it, but it's on the podium top 19 there and evidently it will go red if you try to 20 exceed three minutes, it will warn you to wrap it 21 up and move on and let the next speaker speak. 22 Okay? So if there's anybody that would like 23 to speak in the public comments section, please 24 come forward and be sworn in by the recording 25 secretary. Page 6 1 MS. JOHNSON: Raise your right hand and state 2 your name for the record. 3 MR. SANTANA: Jorge Santana. 4 MS. JOHNSON: Do you affirm to tell the truth, 5 the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? 6 MR. SANTANA: I do. 7 MS. JOHNSON: Thank you. 8 MR. DAVIS: Good morning. 9 MR. SANTANA: Good morning, sir. My wife and 10 my friends here have all become victims of Group 11 One Construction. The general contractor is 12 Mr. Mike Miranda. We have all been stopped in 13 construction -- we've been in construction with him 14 close to two years now. He has failed to complete 15 our homes, breach of contract -- my wife and I have 16 hired an attorney. We have since then fired him, 17 but we are still owed money that we gave him ahead 18 because they insisted for upgrades. Our folks that 19 did our tower work are here. They are owed in 20 excess of $150,000 for work that they did in good 21 faith, and I'm sure they can testify to that. So 22 we are all asking for help. This might not be the 23 medium, but we need to put it on your radar that 24 this company and this individual should be stripped 25 of his license and put in jail. b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 4 (Pages 7 to 10) Page 7 1 MR. DAVIS: Just as a question if I could, you 2 mentioned $150,000. Is that a sum total that 3 you've cumulatively put together among a group or 4 is that -- 5 MR. SANTANA: No, that's just one company, 6 L&M Tile. 7 MR. DAVIS: I mean, as a victim, though, is 8 that something that you have personally 9 experienced -- 10 MR. SANTANA: Personally, my wife and I are 11 out $50,000 because now to complete the home, we 12 need to -- we have hired a new general contractor, 13 and of course the work that he quoted us two years 14 ago, now it's going to be more expensive and 15 there's work that needs to be done that he never 16 quoted to us or to the bank that in order to 17 fulfill the home and pass inspections, we'll need 18 to do. 19 MR. DAVIS: All right. Well, I appreciate you 20 being here this morning. 21 MR. SANTANA: Thank you, sir. 22 MR. DAVIS: Thank you. 23 MS. FERRELL: Good morning. 24 MR. DAVIS: Good morning. 25 MS. FERRELL: I'm Dr. Berta Ferrell Page 8 1 (phonetic). I'm from Broward County and we were -- 2 MR. DAVIS: First things first. 3 MS. JOHNSON: State your name for the record. 4 MS. FERRELL: My name is Berta M. Ferrell. 5 MS. JOHNSON: Do you swear or affirm to tell 6 the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the 7 truth? 8 MS. FERRELL: I do. 9 MS. JOHNSON: Thank you. 10 MR. DAVIS: Good morning. 11 MS. FERRELL: We are from Broward County and 12 my husband and I are retired. And our goal was to 13 build a final third retirement home. And in trying 14 to build the home, we were -- we got with TC Homes, 15 they were highly recommended. At the present time, 16 the amount that we're holding up is over $90,000. 17 This is the amount that Mr. Miranda has for 18 upgrades and his down payment. We are in a 19 contract with him that we're trying to negotiate. 20 We have an attorney so he will be negotiating with 21 the bank to try to get us out of this contract. 22 Now, I also want to let you know we've been to the 23 city here in Port St. Lucie, and when Mr. Miranda 24 got ready to clear my lot, he actually started the 25 work without a building permit. And I got that Page 9 1 information from the City of Port St. Lucie. So my 2 property from the date we signed, which was 3 October 11, 2018, the only work that he did up 4 until July was to clear my lot. And I think he did 5 that just to appease us, but no work -- no other 6 work that he did except continue to get upgrade 7 money from us and to tell us what a great job that 8 he was going to do. Also, his affiliate, Roger, we 9 loved both -- both of them were people that we 10 trusted, but both of them took upgrade money from 11 us and that's how we each -- the people there, we 12 all got to these amounts, and these are individual 13 amounts that we've gotten to, and ours in 14 particular, the Ferrells, is from upgrades and down 15 payments, and this contract to work without a 16 building permit to just appease us, but he never 17 really did any work. And he wouldn't answer. And 18 we tried to make an agreement with him through the 19 bank to release us from the contract so that we 20 could move on with our lives. We're in our 60s so 21 we don't have 10 or 20 years to negotiate with him 22 to do our work. He won't even answer and he owes 23 us this amount of money. 24 MS. JOHNSON: State your name. 25 MR. DAVIS: If you would approach the -- Page 10 1 MS. JOHNSON: State your name for the record. 2 MR. LAWSON: My name is -- 3 MR. DAVIS: Yeah, the -- the microphone. 4 MR. LAWSON: My name is Jared Lawson 5 (phonetic). 6 MS. JOHNSON: Do you affirm to tell the truth, 7 the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? 8 MR. LAWSON: I do. 9 MS. JOHNSON: Thank you. 10 MR. LAWSON: My wife and I are here because 11 we're in the same boat as the rest of the people. 12 In good faith, we trusted -- at the time it was TC 13 Custom Homes. At some point, they changed the name 14 to Group One Construction (inaudible) -- 15 MS. JOHNSON: Oh, sorry. 16 MR. LAWSON: And so -- 17 MR. DAVIS: It looks like they need to reset 18 the button. 19 MR. LAWSON: Who, me? 20 MR. DAVIS: No, our own staff. I'm sorry. 21 MR. LAWSON: Okay. 22 MR. DAVIS: We need to make sure you got your 23 full three minutes. All right. If you need three. 24 MR. LAWSON: Okay. So at the time we trusted 25 these guys. Again, it's a Felix Roger Moore was b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 5 (Pages 11 to 14) Page 11 1 the spokesperson. In fact, we thought the business 2 was owned by him because we never saw the owner 3 until it was time to give money. Once we gave the 4 money, he kept asking for draws and we would give 5 him a draw. He would do a little work at a time. 6 I should say he would appease us so we would keep 7 calling and going into his office. And so at some 8 point he stopped answering phones. He locked his 9 doors. You'd knock on the door. He would be in 10 there. He would open the door. I would go in 11 there. He would leave and go out the back door. 12 He wouldn't talk to me. He wouldn't say anything 13 to me. And at one point it almost got 14 confrontational because I was fed up with going 15 there and getting no answers. 16 And so he and his secretary just completely 17 stopped answering the calls altogether. Right now 18 we're at $65,000 worth of liens on our home. Some 19 of the subcontractor suppliers are here. We owe 20 these guys. We don't have a house yet. We're 21 still trying to build it. And we're hoping also 22 that you-all can help us. If it was up to me -- if 23 it was up to me -- I'm not going to say anymore. 24 Okay? But we want this guy taken care of. And I 25 can't see how the city, the state, the country, can Page 12 1 let these guys continue to do what they do. 2 Because he changed from one name, went to another 3 name, chances are he's going to do it again because 4 that's the law. The law says he can do this under 5 a different name. And I think the law should be 6 changed to (inaudible). They think they can do 7 this. We don't go to work every day and pay our 8 taxes to give our money -- hand our money over to 9 some unscrupulous guy and his business practice. 10 We want something done. And like I said -- like 11 she said, we don't know if you can do it for us, 12 but I'm pretty sure this is the first step to 13 getting something done. Thank you. 14 MR. DAVIS: Yes, sir. Anybody else like to 15 speak in public comment? Yes, sir. 16 MS. JOHNSON: State your name for the record? 17 MR. COOK: Michael Cook. 18 MS. JOHNSON: Do you affirm to tell the truth, 19 the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? 20 MR. COOK: I do. 21 MS. JOHNSON: Thank you. 22 MR. COOK: I'm Dr. Michael Cook. I'm a 23 dentist here locally in Port St. Lucie. Also the 24 president of CNC Wellness, Inc. I started building 25 a home with Mike Miranda about a year ago. It was Page 13 1 a big job. It had a lot of demo and that kind of 2 thing. There was an old house on the property. 3 And that seemed to be going along relatively well. 4 At that same time I decided that I was going to 5 open another business. It's something my wife and 6 I had rolling around in our brain for a long time. 7 And as unfortunate circumstances happened, we 8 contracted with him to do the build out on that 9 commercial space. It was a cash deal. It was 10 supposed to have been a 30-day job. We started 11 that in February. The whole contract was only 12 $112,000 so it wasn't a big contract but, you know, 13 I never got any notice to owners because I don't 14 own the space. It's a space that I'm leasing. 15 And, you know, he would do a little and 16 everything would be like kind of half done, half 17 done. But I wanted it to move along quickly so of 18 course I gave him the draws as he requested and 19 then come to find out he didn't pay anybody. He 20 didn't pay any subs. So I ended up giving him 21 $90,000 and he didn't pay a soul. So, you know, I 22 owed $22,000 on the contract. I've already hired a 23 new contractor. The amount to finish the job is 24 only $40,000 -- you know, $43,000. But I had to 25 pay, you know, the electrician was $25,000 and, you Page 14 1 know, the dumpster people, I still haven't paid 2 them. But at any rate, so that job is moving 3 along, but I've lost a lot of money on that job. 4 You know, I haven't -- you know, I'm paying lease 5 on the space. 6 I'm not open so I'm not bringing in any money. 7 I've sold a ton of memberships, it's a fitness 8 facility, but I don't get the money because we're 9 not open. You know? So it's hard. So -- and, of 10 course, the same thing at the house. It's on a 11 construction loan so he didn't get any draws that 12 he wasn't entitled to, but before the last draw, he 13 couldn't get any of the releases because he hadn't 14 paid the subs, paint and supplies, the windows were 15 $35,000. Electrical contractor was on that same 16 draw, it was $10,000. So, you know, my house has 17 been sitting there for months. Nobody has done a 18 thing with it. And there's liens on both 19 properties. And, you know, just I -- I fired him 20 from the boot camp but I haven't fired him from the 21 house yet. 22 He didn't do a thing to prepare the site for 23 the hurricane. It's a dumpster full of stuff, a 24 porta potty is out there. The windows are in, the 25 doors are there, but there's no way to latch them b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 6 (Pages 15 to 18) Page 15 1 down. You know, it's just -- I don't have a roof 2 on it yet. It's just peel and stick. It's been on 3 there for over 90 days. It's no good anymore. So 4 he's just totally ignoring every job. And when you 5 talk to him on the phone, I've been able to talk to 6 him a few times and he's just full of excuses. 7 "Oh, I got behind. My guys ran over a telephone 8 pole and knocked out power and I don't have any 9 money." 10 Well, you know, I gave him $90,000 in the boot 11 camp. It was enough to complete the whole job. 12 The rest of it would have been profit. And he just 13 didn't -- he did very little and he didn't pay the 14 subs. So, you know, he -- he should have his 15 license stripped. My understanding is it's a 16 scenario he's done more than once in the past. We 17 filed for bankruptcy, let a bunch of people eat up 18 his debt and move on and here he is doing it again. 19 So hopefully we can get the ball rolling here. You 20 know, my commercial space is in Martin County. I'm 21 going to do the same thing there with the State. 22 I've retained an attorney. So hopefully we can -- 23 we can get his license taken away. All right? 24 Thank you. 25 MR. DAVIS: Thank you. I want to say to the Page 16 1 public that's here that does want to speak in 2 public comment, I'm seeing a pattern here and what 3 I'm hearing is everybody is wanting to speak about 4 the same individual? And they are all wanting to 5 say similar things. 6 UNKNOWN FEMALE: Yes. 7 MR. DAVIS: So we can go on forever, but if 8 there are others that would like to continue 9 showing us the pattern, feel free. This is what 10 public comment is, but I do see that we are getting 11 a pattern in our comments that I'm hearing. And 12 the Board is recognizing. So if someone else would 13 like to continue, please come up and be sworn in by 14 the recording secretary. 15 MS. JOHNSON: State your name for the record. 16 MR. JOHNSTON: Michael Johnston. 17 MS. JOHNSON: And do you affirm to tell the 18 truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? 19 MR. JOHNSTON: I do. Good morning. 20 MR. DAVIS: Good morning. 21 MR. JOHNSTON: Thank you-all for listening to 22 me. A different situation here. I represent a lot 23 of things. I'm with Stuart Paint and Supply. I'm 24 one of the owners. Also your president of the 25 Treasure Coast Builders Association. I sat on the Page 17 1 National Homebuilders Board and the Florida 2 Homebuilders Board as directors. Unfortunately, 3 I'm one of the people that have liens on all of 4 these folks' homes. I'm owed roughly $240,000. 5 I've known Mike about 20 years, been working with 6 him off and on. Mike has always been slow, but he 7 would get there until recently. And he opened -- 8 he started down a path, he picked the right people 9 that didn't really know what was going on in 10 construction lien laws. He picked the people where 11 he could get money without releasing of liens. And 12 he started a vicious circle of robbing Peter to pay 13 Paul and I think he also included Mike in those 14 payments. I'm here to try and help these folks. 15 I'll do whatever I can do to try and work 16 things out with them, and if they will -- you know, 17 if they want to reach out. I have around $80,000 18 worth of products on some of these homes that are 19 still sitting in my warehouse. I was a peer 20 supplier to Mike, but I'm also a general 21 contractor. I'll provide them for a very nominal 22 fee, installation labor for these products, most of 23 it is windows. I'm here to help, whatever I can do 24 to help. Something in Florida has to be done. 25 This is a vicious circle. A lot of these people Page 18 1 are cash buyers, there are very few bank buyers, 2 and a cash customer is easier to rip off. I'm 3 having a meeting with the Florida Homebuilders on 4 the first weekend of October to approach some 5 legislation to the State of Florida to try to get a 6 system where we can appoint a state bank or a group 7 of state banks to hold the money for cash buyers so 8 there will be an inspection process just as if 9 there was a mortgage involved to protect them from 10 this situation, but if any of these folks want to 11 reach out, I'm here to help. And I thank you-all 12 for your testimony. 13 MR. DAVIS: Thank you. Anyone else like to 14 speak? We appreciate everybody being here today. 15 And we will -- is there one other speaker? Yes? 16 Okay. 17 MS. JOHNSON: State your name for the record. 18 MR. AYBAR: My name is Emerson Aybar. The 19 owner of L&M Elite Services. 20 MS. JOHNSON: Do you affirm to tell the truth, 21 the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? 22 MR. AYBAR: Yes, I do. 23 MS. JOHNSON: Thank you. 24 MR. DAVIS: Morning. 25 MR. AYBAR: Morning. So I'm the owner of a b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 7 (Pages 19 to 22) Page 19 1 tile installation company. And Mike and TC Homes 2 contracted me to do multiple homes. And right now 3 he owes me over $165,000. And a lot of the 4 products that we have, we still have for some of 5 these homes and Mike kept, you know, bringing me 6 along and saying, "Hey, I got you, I got you, I got 7 you," and "I'm going to get you paid," which 8 everything was a lie. And, unfortunately, I have 9 liens on everybody's houses. So -- and I'm here 10 just to really speak on behalf of a lot of the 11 homeowners here. He is a very dishonest person. 12 And unfortunately for me this isn't the first time 13 this happened to me. This happened to me with 14 another contractor who was out there running around 15 freely, which was not right. He got picked up a 16 job and, you know, I just don't see -- as a 17 subcontractor, as a homeowner, we're the ones that 18 always get victimized. 19 And I'm seeing general contractors get away 20 with everything. They just file bankruptcy. I've 21 gotten three bankruptcy letters from three 22 different general contractors who owe me money, and 23 you know, you trust and play the game and you 24 always get burnt at the end. So subcontractors and 25 homeowners get burnt and I'm getting to the point Page 20 1 where I'm just like, I'm over it. This money here, 2 this is my kids' money, my retirement, you know, 3 and this is not the first time I've gotten burnt. 4 And, unfortunately, on the other ones I can't 5 collect a dime, and those were about $90,000 from 6 the other contractors. And I'm just to the point I 7 -- I don't get this. 8 I'm here to work, do a job, and it's a simple 9 process. You get contracted to do something, you 10 collect the money, pay for all of your materials, 11 pay for labor, and you collect at the end, right? 12 That's the way it's supposed to happen. And it 13 ain't working because this has gotten ridiculous. 14 And I'm not seeing any help from the State, from 15 anybody because I'm seeing the guy from last year 16 that burnt me for a lot of money going around -- 17 and I see him on Facebook and I see him everywhere, 18 just buy this buy that, but he's walking around 19 freely where he stole money from people just like 20 these folks got stolen by this guy and nothing is 21 getting done. 22 And it's got to end, you know? And there's 23 not enough of what I can say that might do 24 anything, but I'm hoping that you folks can put the 25 word in one voice and take it up to the State. Page 21 1 People like him, people like the other guy, need to 2 go to the jail. Simple as that, because this? 3 This is not right. This is not right. I have to 4 spend my time to be here with them. This is not 5 right. We got better things to do. Okay? This 6 I'm telling you -- this is my -- this is my 7 retirement. Okay. I've been working hard. I 8 started from nothing to something. Okay? And then 9 people like this just steel money from us. It's 10 stolen money. I have employees. I have to take 11 care of people. 12 MR. DAVIS: Thank you, sir. And just as a 13 point of clarification, you do need to understand 14 that we're a licensing board and we're not a court 15 of law. I'm sure it sounds like this will go to 16 other avenues for compensation. We're here to 17 address issues of licensure. So that's what we're 18 going to be touching on further in our agenda 19 because here we are still in public comment. But, 20 again, I will say we do hear your voice and we do 21 hear the pattern and this is a lot of money 22 outstanding. This is something that evidently has 23 been done and perpetrated against a number of 24 people that I can see and it's added up to some 25 large dollars. Is there anyone else that would Page 22 1 like to speak? Okay. If you'd come up and be 2 sworn in by the recording secretary, please. 3 MS. JOHNSON: State your name for the record. 4 MR. WINGFARROW: James Wingfarrow (phonetic). 5 MS. JOHNSON: Do you affirm to tell the truth, 6 the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? 7 MR. WINGFARROW: Yes. Just a question if this 8 is not the place to get help. We know we're going 9 to file legal charges through the State Attorney's 10 Office. The license needs to be revoked when you 11 have evidence from the city showing this guy never 12 pulled a permit for five months on my property 13 doing things and lied for five months, Roger Moore, 14 and this Mike Miranda. He has a license. We're 15 looking for the license to get taken and we want to 16 prosecute this guy through law enforcement, but 17 that's the purpose we're here with you today. He 18 don't need the license to do this, he's going to 19 change the name again and go again, but whatever 20 you can do that's what we need. You represent the 21 city. This guy is making a bad name to be in 22 Port St. Lucie. In Broward County, I built three 23 houses and never a problem. But we got crooks 24 everywhere, we know that. But you are our back up 25 so that's what we're looking for here today. We b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 8 (Pages 23 to 26) Page 23 1 need -- people -- we don't take the law out of our 2 own hands. He's doing that. We would like to 3 protect ourselves. I'm afraid this kind of guy 4 with that kind of nerve or stupidity might drive up 5 to my door just to move me out because he thinks he 6 can get away with it. People get hurt by taking 7 money without a gun and walking around free as he's 8 the king. Well, we're not freedom but we work for 9 a living. We have people like you to de-license 10 these people. We have the law enforcement and 11 rules and law to protect us. And we're not getting 12 it. So we're here today to get you to do your job 13 and hear our case, investigate, and move him out of 14 here. We are going to keep him on the run if he 15 don't go to jail. Thank you. 16 MR. DAVIS: Thank you. I appreciate you being 17 here. I do want to clarify when I mentioned that 18 we're a licensing board, yes, we're here concerning 19 licensure and address that, not only for 20 St. Lucie County but also send that to the State. 21 So that's -- that's something that we do, and also 22 further clarification is we are volunteers. We are 23 not paid employees of St. Lucie County so you got 24 to understand that too. This board is made up by 25 individuals from the construction industry and from Page 24 1 the general community that know construction and so 2 we all give up our time to serve on this board. 3 And if we're in the industry, I'll tell you our 4 heart goes out because we feel like we're being 5 taken advantage of too because we have our own 6 licenses, we have our own insurances and we're 7 abiding by the law and we definitely get upset 8 along with you when we see those that think they 9 can skirt the law and take advantage and be 10 profitable in it. And that's definitely something 11 that we are in opposition to as well. So we hear 12 your voice. Is there anyone else that would like 13 to speak? If you would -- I think you need to come 14 to the podium and be heard in the microphone and be 15 sworn in. If you would, please come to the podium 16 and be sworn in and let the microphone pick you up 17 so we can record what you had to say for us. 18 MR. MAZANOSKI: Just real quick -- 19 MR. DAVIS: No, no, no. Let's go ahead and be 20 recorded and -- 21 MR. MAZANOSKI: Detective Mitch Mazanoski with 22 the St. Lucie County Sheriff's Office. Just real 23 quick, I'm not part of this meeting here -- 24 MR. DAVIS: Do you swear to tell the truth, 25 the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? Page 25 1 MS. JOHNSON: Do you swear to tell the truth, 2 the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? 3 MR. MAZANOSKI: Yes, I do. 4 MR. DAVIS: I knew you would but that's just a 5 formality, sir. I'm sorry. 6 MR. MAZANOSKI: I just want everybody that was 7 standing up here talking, I want you guys as a 8 group after this meeting just to kind of go over 9 everything with you and the direction that this is 10 going to go. So hang out for me and we'll be 11 talking right after this. Okay? 12 MR. DAVIS: All right. Thank you. Sorry. I 13 had to make you do all that but that's what we do. 14 Okay. Anybody else like to speak? All right. 15 Very good. Thank you-all for being here and having 16 your voices heard. We are going to start our 17 meeting now and it's not a long agenda and it does 18 appear that is one of the last things on that 19 agenda, but it won't be long for us to get to it if 20 you do want to stay and listen to that. 21 Our first line of business today are 22 applications that we have received for us to review 23 for approval for licensure in St. Lucie County. 24 Our first list of those applications that are 25 recommended for approval by consent, Board, is Page 26 1 there anyone from the consent list that needs to be 2 pulled before we take a vote? If not, I'd receive 3 a motion, please. 4 MR. HUDSPETH: So moved, motion (inaudible) 5 agenda. 6 MR. DAVIS: Motion by Mr. Hudspeth. 7 MR. PRIDE: Second. 8 MR. DAVIS: Second by Mr. Pride. Any 9 discussion? All in favor, say aye. 10 MULTIPLE VOICES: Aye. 11 MR. DAVIS: Any opposed? That is unanimous. 12 Madam Secretary, if you would please read those 13 names into the roll. 14 MS. JOHNSON: Patrick J. Gross, Surfside 15 Pressure Cleaning & Painting, LLC, painting 16 contractor. Juan C. Reinoso, master electrician, 17 non-contractor. Robert A. Karbacka, master 18 electrician, non-contractor. 19 MR. DAVIS: Thank you, Madam Secretary. Our 20 next list of applicants are those that are 21 recommended for approval by reciprocity. Board, 22 may I hear a motion? 23 MR. HUDSPETH: Motion to accept. 24 MR. LANGEL: Second. 25 MR. DAVIS: Motion by Mr. Hudspeth and a b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 9 (Pages 27 to 30) Page 27 1 second by Mr. Langel. Any discussion? All in 2 favor say aye. 3 MULTIPLE VOICES: Aye. 4 MR. DAVIS: Any opposed? Also unanimous, 5 thank you, Madam Secretary, if you would read those 6 names into the roll for us. 7 MS. JOHNSON: Vishu J. Lyn, Immaculate Air & 8 Appliance Corp., class B air conditioning 9 contractor. Andrea I. Franceschi, Franceschi 10 Marble & Granite, Inc., tile and marble contractor. 11 Nevin T. Meyer, Iron City Flooring, Inc., tile and 12 marble contractor. Todd M. Paroline, Superior 13 Fence & Rail of Brevard County, Inc., fence 14 contractor. 15 MR. DAVIS: Thank you. Our next list of 16 applicants are those that have been approved 17 administratively based on their reciprocities from 18 the City of Port St. Lucie or Fort Pierce. Madam 19 Secretary, if you would read those names into the 20 roll, please? 21 MS. JOHNSON: Michael A. Romack, Michael A. 22 Romack Contracting, Inc., building contractor. 23 Michael W. Sanicky, Mike's Aluminum Specialties, 24 Inc., aluminum with concrete contractor. Daniel 25 Pellick, D & S Painting of South Florida, Inc., Page 28 1 painting contractor. Jerome Kacprowicz, Guaranteed 2 Garage Repair, LLC, garage door contractor. Samuel 3 S. Cardoso, Dream Contractors, Inc., tile and 4 marble contractor. Richard Sasina, Treasure Coast 5 Painting, Inc., painting contractor. 6 MR. DAVIS: Thank you, Madam Secretary. Our 7 last applicant is one that is recommended for 8 review by the Board. So I will let staff then 9 bring us up to speed on this particular 10 application. 11 MRS. WILLIAMS: Good morning. 12 MR. DAVIS: Good morning. 13 MRS. WILLIAMS: Mr. Sanicky is requesting to 14 be reciprocity by the City of Port St. Lucie. 15 However, under section 10-63(c), he needs a letter 16 of reciprocity which requires the applicant test 17 score for the category he has requested. The 18 letter of reciprocity from Palm Beach County only 19 shows test scores in business and law and not the 20 trade. He has been licensed in Palm Beach County 21 since 1994. Only business and law was required at 22 that time. The City of Port St. Lucie accepted a 23 letter of reciprocity from Palm Beach County and 24 issued him a license on September 9, 2018. The 25 county did not require competency for windows and Page 29 1 doors until July 26, 2005. The staff is requesting 2 the Board accept the letter of reciprocity from 3 Palm Beach County and allow him to reciprocate from 4 the City of Port St. Lucie. 5 MR. DAVIS: Thank you. I think that was well 6 laid out by staff and we did get in advance in our 7 packet the review text on this particular applicant 8 and the reasons for the recommendation that we have 9 received. Is there any questions of staff? If 10 Mr. Sanicky is here and would like to speak, I'd 11 like to give him that opportunity, please. If you 12 would come forward and be sworn in by the recording 13 secretary. 14 MS. JOHNSON: State your name for the record. 15 MR. SANICKY: Michael Sanicky. 16 MS. JOHNSON: Do you affirm to tell the truth, 17 the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? 18 MR. SANICKY: I do. 19 MR. DAVIS: And I apologize for mispronouncing 20 your name. 21 MR. SANICKY: Oh, that's quite all right. 22 Like they said, I got my license in '94. At the 23 time, that's -- that covered the windows and doors. 24 I've been doing windows and doors since the early 25 '80s. And then on down the county -- after -- I Page 30 1 don't -- it was years after that they wanted to -- 2 wanted me to get a license, but I was grandfathered 3 in. I just did the paperwork. I've been pulling 4 window license permits the whole time up to that 5 point. I got my additional education for the 6 contractors. I went through that this year. All 7 upgraded on that. Signed up with, you know, all of 8 the municipalities around Palm Beach, Jupiter, all 9 the way down through Lake Worth. So we do a good 10 -- good business with windows and aluminum work and 11 we have been for 28 years. So -- 12 MR. DAVIS: I appreciate you coming. I did 13 notice the first thing even before I read the text 14 review of staff it did catch my eye that you hadn't 15 been tested in the actual trade but you had the 16 business and law portion, but then as I read and 17 understood it, it's because it wasn't part of the 18 testing in '94. So not until '05 did we start 19 requiring that aspect of a trade knowledge portion 20 to the test. So we recognize where you're at and 21 my own opinion is that I think this man has done 22 everything expected of him from 1994 until the 23 current. There's no recognition of any disputes 24 he's had or complaints. It's just a clean record. 25 He's been a good community citizen in his trade and b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 10 (Pages 31 to 34) Page 31 1 I see no reason at all to deny him his licensure 2 here in St. Lucie County, but that's a chairman's 3 opinion who doesn't vote. But I just open up the 4 discussion if there is any discussion of the 5 applicant, I'll let the Board go ahead and ask you 6 while you're at the podium. 7 MR. LEONARD: This is one of the reasons why 8 this license board is here. We have a gentleman 9 that's been in business now since 1994. And like 10 you've said before, there was no testing back then. 11 This man has ran a successful business for this 12 amount of time. He's coming in here and he wants 13 to be licensed so we can keep record of him. I'll 14 make a motion to approve based on staff's 15 recommendation a letter for reciprocity. 16 MR. PARKER: Second. 17 MR. DAVIS: All right. That was a motion by 18 Mr. Leonard and a second by Mr. Parker. Any 19 discussion? All in favor say aye. 20 MULTIPLE VOICES: Aye. 21 MR. DAVIS: Any opposed? That was unanimous. 22 So I appreciate you being here this morning. 23 MR. SANICKY: Thank you very much. Have a 24 good weekend. 25 MR. DAVIS: We wish you all the best here. It Page 32 1 looks like we have two citation appeals of which 2 one has been pulled. I hope that was 3 satisfactorily brought to conclusion. If not, I 4 guess, we'll hear about it in a future meeting. 5 The one that is still on the agenda this morning is 6 Mr. John F. Tierno of 3G Services, LLC. Staff, if 7 you would please bring us up on that. 8 MR. CICIO: Good morning. 9 MR. DAVIS: Good morning. 10 MR. CICIO: For the record, I'm submitting a 11 copy of the complaint and proposal for construction 12 repairs under the name of 3G Services, LLC, on 5/15 13 of '19, a complaint was filed against Manta Ray 14 Construction, Mr. Steven Drake Marston, who pulled 15 the permit for a leave roof at the property of 6306 16 Arapahoe Street in Fort Pierce. The property 17 owner, Barbara M. Ruiz, has provided a copy of the 18 proposal for construction repairs under the name of 19 3G Services Florida, LLC, for performing roof work. 20 Upon investigation, it was determined that 3G 21 Services Florida, LLC, is not a licensed roofing 22 contractor. On 8/15/19 I issued a citation in the 23 amount of $500 to the business owner of 3G Services 24 Florida, which was served by certified mail. On 25 8/29 of '19 Mr. Tierno submitted a request to Page 33 1 appeal the citation issued. On 8/26 Mr. Tierno 2 made contact with staff and advised that he does 3 not know why the proposal is in his name. He 4 stated that Manta Ray Construction is the 5 contractor who completed the work and that he 6 previously gave Manta Ray Construction referrals 7 for work. 8 On 8/29 a notice to appear was mailed 9 certified mail which was properly served. As of 10 9/17, yesterday, Mr. Tierno has failed to pay the 11 citation nor correct the issue by obtaining a 12 proper license to perform roofing work. No further 13 communication has been made. Therefore, staff is 14 requesting to place a lien on Mr. Tierno's real 15 and/or personal property if the citation is not 16 paid within 30 days. 17 MR. DAVIS: Any questions of staff? So that I 18 understand, the name 3G Services came from 19 specifically an agreement or a contract that you 20 received from the owner? 21 MR. CICIO: Correct, it was a proposal 22 agreement that was submitted with the complaint. 23 MR. DAVIS: Sorry? 24 MR. CICIO: It was a proposal agreement that 25 was submitted from the property owner with the Page 34 1 complaint. 2 MR. DAVIS: Okay. So that complaint came from 3 the owner and that owner had recognition through a 4 contract agreement that that was between him and 3G 5 although the work was being done by someone else? 6 MR. CICIO: The permit was pulled by Manta Ray 7 Construction, but the proposal that she had 8 received for that work for that particular job site 9 was under 3G Services Florida, LLC. 10 MR. DAVIS: Okay. Any other questions of 11 staff? All right. Is there a Mr. John Tierno? 12 MR. TIERNO: No, Joseph. Joseph Frank Tierno, 13 sir. 14 MR. DAVIS: Okay. If you would then be 15 recorded by the recording secretary, please. 16 MS. JOHNSON: State your name for the record. 17 MR. TIERNO: Joseph Frank Tierno. 18 MS. JOHNSON: Do you affirm to the tell the 19 truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? 20 MR. TIERNO: I do. 21 MS. JOHNSON: Thank you. 22 MR. DAVIS: If you could tell us exactly your 23 relationship in this particular case. 24 MR. TIERNO: I am now the owner of 3G 25 Services. My nephew was the owner at the time of b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 11 (Pages 35 to 38) Page 35 1 the job being done. I am a services company that 2 has done emergency tarping for people that have 3 roof leaks and I do it straight through the 4 insurance companies. I'm not a contractor. I do 5 not write contracts. I have given Drake Marston a 6 lot of work because of people that know me for 7 doing the tarps on their roofs and stuff like that 8 and I have all of the information that he bought 9 all of the material and stuff like that and that he 10 is the contractor with Ms. Barbara Ruiz. I don't 11 know where he got my heading from to put my name on 12 3G Services. I have other contracts from NYC 13 Services that are exactly the same as the contract 14 that he wrote for Ms. Barbara Ruiz and he must of 15 just switched the heading because we wound up into 16 a bad relationship because he owed a lot of other 17 clients money. So this is one way for him to get 18 back at me. 19 I did not put my name on any contract. I do 20 not write contracts. I just write invoice s. So I 21 know Ms. Barbara Ruiz was going through a hard time 22 with the death of her son who was very ill at the 23 time. So she must have signed something that she 24 didn't look at the top of, but I was there to guide 25 her through the work of Mr. Marston and make sure Page 36 1 the job got done correctly. The only thing I did 2 on her house was do a soffit repair which is one 3 little piece of plywood that needed to be done 4 through the city said that -- its final inspection 5 if the soffit wasn't done. Drake Marston was all 6 over the place in Texas and Panama City doing 7 everything else and he wasn't complying with his 8 part of the deal with her. He received all of the 9 money from her. I did not receive any moneys. She 10 paid him cash for the jobs. I have all of the 11 receipts that he got from Extreme Metals and 12 everything was paid under his company because he 13 was running the job. So for him to get back at me, 14 and he has a lot of bad reputation in the City of 15 Port St. Lucie and Fort Pierce and everything with 16 not closing out permits on jobs, and a lot of 17 people put lawsuits against him because he robbed 18 another two clients that I've known that I've had 19 roofing jobs for that he owed them a lot of money. 20 And I know the last payment from Ms. Barbara 21 Ruiz had to go to another client that he failed to 22 pay within like one year, and he ordered like over 23 $8,000, pulled a permit for her job in Palm City, 24 took money from her within six months and never did 25 any type of work so she had to find another Page 37 1 contractor to do her roof and stuff like that. So 2 where he got my name of 3G Services and -- what 3 that contract is, I have no clue, because it wasn't 4 me. I did not sign anything. And at that time, 5 like I said, it was my nephew's company and he does 6 not know anything about construction or anything. 7 MR. DAVIS: But you -- were you not an 8 intermediary that aligned him as a roofing 9 subcontractor to perform the work for the owner? 10 MR. TIERNO: He's not a subcontractor. He was 11 the actual contractor on the job. 12 MR. DAVIS: Well, subcontractor or contractor, 13 he had direct relationship with the owner, 14 according to you? 15 MR. TIERNO: Yes. 16 MR. DAVIS: You were involved in some way, 17 shape, or form by -- in what way? By recommending 18 him and aligning him as the roofing -- licensed 19 roofing contractor to perform the work for the 20 owner? 21 MR. TIERNO: Correct. 22 MR. DAVIS: Okay. I just wanted to make sure 23 I understood that. 24 MR. TIERNO: Yes. 25 MR. DAVIS: All right. So you do know who Page 38 1 this individual was and you actually recommended 2 this individual? 3 MR. TIERNO: That is correct. I recommended 4 him for a lot of jobs and he failed to comply with 5 getting the work done for a lot of people. 6 MR. DAVIS: Uh-huh. Okay. And you are 7 suggesting that he has fraudulently taken your 8 identity and put it on his documents? 9 MR. TIERNO: That is correct, sir. That is 10 what I'm stating as the truth, because if it was my 11 contract and I was a quote-unquote, contractor, my 12 signature would be on that document stating that I 13 was the owner and receiving money as a contractor. 14 But my signature is not on there because I never 15 drew up a contract. All I do is write invoices for 16 tarping roofs to insurance companies. That's it. 17 MR. DAVIS: Any other questions? 18 UNKNOWN MALE: I have a question. So you 19 received no moneys from Ms. Ruiz? 20 MR. TIERNO: That is correct. 21 MR. LEONARD: I have a question for staff. 22 How did you guys get involved in this? 23 MR. CICIO: It was a complaint -- a public 24 complaint that was received from the property 25 owner. b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 12 (Pages 39 to 42) Page 39 1 MR. LEONARD: And she made a complaint to 2 staff based on? 3 MR. CICIO: It was Manta Ray Construction, the 4 one who pulled the permit. It was in regards to 5 the craftsmanship or work that was performed on her 6 property. 7 MR. ZRALLACK: I have a question for staff. 8 How -- how is Manta Ray Construction associated 9 with this project? The complaint was filed against 10 them but I don't see their name on any -- on 11 anything. 12 MR. CICIO: They were the ones who pulled the 13 permit for the reroof job. But when we received 14 the complaint, the invoice that we received the 15 proposal was under 3G Services Florida. 16 MR. ZRALLACK: Okay. So Manta Ray pulled the 17 permit? 18 MR. CICIO: Correct. 19 MR. ZRALLACK: So then why was the citation -- 20 the citation was filed against 3G, not the company 21 that pulled the permit? 22 MR. CICIO: That's correct. The proposal that 23 was received, we read the proposal. It says right 24 on here that work will be scheduled and commenced 25 -- will begin when deposit clears 3G Services Page 40 1 Florida, LLC's account. The color of the roofing 2 material is listed on here. It's signed by Barbara 3 Ruiz. The information on the bottom is 3G Services 4 Florida, gives you an exact address of Mr. Tierno. 5 MR. LEONARD: Excuse me. I have a question. 6 I'm sorry. I forgot your name. What's your name 7 again? 8 MR. TIERNO: Joseph. 9 MR. LEONARD: Joseph. So you're the owner of 10 3G Services? 11 MR. TIERNO: Yes, I am, sir. 12 MR. LEONARD: So at that moment in time when 13 she wrote a check for 3G Services -- 14 MR. TIERNO: She never wrote a check for me, 15 sir. 16 MR. LEONARD: She wrote a check for 3G 17 Services? 18 MR. TIERNO: She never wrote a check to me. 19 She never paid me a penny. 20 MR. LEONARD: Who did she write a check to? 21 MR. TIERNO: She paid cash to Drake Marston. 22 MR. LEONARD: And Drake Marston at that time 23 is -- 24 MR. TIERNO: Manta Ray. Manta Ray Services, 25 yes. Page 41 1 MR. LEONARD: Manta Ray? 2 MR. TIERNO: Because I have other -- other 3 things that are from NYC Services contracts that 4 are the same contract as that 3G Services. So all 5 he did was change the heading on it, but the format 6 is exactly the same to prove that I did not make 7 that document up. 8 MS. WILLIAMS: Mr. Chairman of the Board, in 9 your package is a proposal from 3G. He's here 10 today because according to the proposal he's acting 11 as a roofing contractor. That's why we gave him 12 the $500 citation. Manta Ray, they pulled the 13 permit. The permit was final, but he's here today 14 because according to the document we got from the 15 property owner, he's acting as a licensed 16 contractor. That's why he got the citation. 17 MR. DAVIS: Yeah, but this gentleman is here 18 and he has evidence -- I don't know if he provided 19 this evidence to staff prior to today's meeting 20 that would reveal that there is a formatted or a 21 typical contract agreement that that particular 22 Manta Ray has used and it happens now to have 3G 23 Services heading on it. Has that been submitted to 24 staff prior to today or we're just hearing about 25 that now as we're receiving testimony? Page 42 1 MS. WILLIAMS: It is up to the Board to invoke 2 the $500 citation. That is up to the Board. If 3 you decide that you agree with him that, you know, 4 it's fraudulent, it's up to the Board to revoke the 5 fine. 6 MS. BARBIERI: And, Mr. Chairman, the 7 documents that (inaudible), we need to actually 8 have the Board see them and we need at least copies 9 of them so they are part of the record. 10 MR. DAVIS: Let me ask you first, is this 11 something that we want to go ahead and review now 12 or do we want to let staff receive whatever that is 13 and then come back at our next meeting, because 14 this may, of course, now evolve to be something 15 that we pursue against another contractor in lieu 16 of 3G, or do we want to go ahead and address that 17 and get it -- 18 MS. BARBIERI: That's the Board's discretion. 19 If you feel like you want to continue this for 20 staff to look into it further, the Board may do 21 that. 22 MR. DAVIS: I'm thinking that we got a can of 23 worms here and there may be one -- more than one or 24 two worms that -- this isn't good. 25 MR. LEONARD: Sorry to interrupt. I need a b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 13 (Pages 43 to 46) Page 43 1 lot more information even that this come to light 2 -- that this gentleman cited in his proposal, 3 somebody else said that fraudulently. 4 MR. DAVIS: So I would suggest that we go 5 ahead and put this back to staff to take the 6 information that has been brought to us this 7 morning and digest and bring it back to us. And 8 I've already heard about 3G, which it sounds like 9 we may not have an issue with 3G, but to also bring 10 whatever else comes to light and what needs to be 11 addressed by the Board and reheard with further 12 information as being presented this morning. Would 13 that be agreeable to the Board? 14 MR. ZRALLACK: Motion to postpone the citation 15 appeal, case number 98979, to allow staff further 16 time to review additional information. 17 MR. DAVIS: Motion by Mr. Zrallack. Second by 18 Mr. Hudspeth? 19 MR. HUDSPETH: Yes. 20 MR. DAVIS: Any discussion? 21 MR. TIERNO: I have a quick question. 22 MR. DAVIS: Yes, sir. 23 MR. TIERNO: I'm getting ready to move to 24 Arizona. So I'll give you all the documents you 25 need and if you need me to come back I'll have to Page 44 1 fly back. So I'll just need some time to -- you 2 know, and I'll mail you another -- email you 3 another address that I'm moving to and stuff like 4 that, because I'm going to be with my family. So 5 I'll give you all the information you need and all 6 the documents you need, and if you could just get 7 back to me within a specific time. And if I have 8 to fly back to handle this case, I will. 9 MR. DAVIS: No, I don't want you to have to 10 fly back. So with that understanding do we need to 11 go ahead and delve into this and go ahead and let 12 the worms crawl out of the can in this medium? I 13 look to our staff and to our attorney, maybe, to 14 advise us as a Board. 15 MS. BARBIERI: Well, I believe there's a 16 motion pending so we need to deal with that first 17 and then -- yeah, I mean, staff can deal with it 18 and if staff finds that they do not wish to proceed 19 with the citation then they can always not proceed. 20 So that's -- that's something for the Board to 21 understand. 22 MR. DAVIS: Yeah. And my concern was that if 23 the staff does determine that we do want to proceed 24 against 3G then we haven't addressed it this 25 morning and this individual is out of the state and Page 45 1 all of a sudden there's a hardship on his part. So 2 that's the kind of thought I wanted to put into 3 whatever we do. I really suggested it and I 4 appreciate the motion and the second. So we are 5 under discussion so let's go ahead and have 6 discussion and then go ahead and vote on the motion 7 as it stands. 8 MR. ZRALLACK: Mr. Chair, there may be legal 9 -- a legal part of this case that may need time to 10 develop as well. So I think postponing is the 11 right decision. 12 MR. DAVIS: Okay. 13 MR. ZRALLACK: And we would recommend that you 14 maybe check into that before you leave to Arizona. 15 Is there fraudulent activity here, you may need to 16 get that taken care of. 17 MR. LEONARD: To piggyback on his comment, 18 there might be many more organizations and 19 municipalities that this person did this to. 20 MR. DAVIS: Any other comment from Board? 21 Okay. There's been a motion and a second. All in 22 favor say aye. 23 MULTIPLE VOICES: Aye. 24 MR. DAVIS: Any opposed? Okay. Then we will 25 then delay this until our next meeting and allow Page 46 1 then -- I'm sorry, it's Joseph and the last name? 2 MR. TIERNO: Tierno. 3 MR. DAVIS: Okay. Joseph, if you would please 4 spend the time with staff to turn over the 5 evidences you've brought with you so that they can 6 digest that and come to conclusions and look at 7 this in a broader picture as you've presented it, 8 and then come back to us at our next board meeting. 9 MR. TIERNO: Thank you. 10 MR. DAVIS: All right. I appreciate you 11 coming this morning. 12 MR. TIERNO: No worries. 13 MR. DAVIS: And sharing time with our staff. 14 MR. TIERNO: Thank you. 15 MR. DAVIS: Okay. Thank you, sir. 16 MR. TIERNO: Thank you, everybody. 17 MR. DAVIS: All right. On our agenda, our 18 last item before we get to old business, which 19 means our real business, is a disciplinary case, 20 and that is the one that you've -- most of you have 21 come to hear, that against a Group One Construction 22 and development, Michael Miranda. I turn that over 23 to staff, please. 24 MR. CICIO: Good morning, again. For the 25 record I'm submitting a copy of the complaint. b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 14 (Pages 47 to 50) Page 47 1 Recorded lien and email from Michael J. Miranda, 2 Group One Construction and Development, Inc. On 3 8/2 of '19 a complaint was filed against Group One 4 Construction and Development, Inc., Michael J. 5 Miranda, who pulled the permit at 7731 Silver Oak 6 Drive, Port St. Lucie, Florida 34952. Upon 7 investigation, it was found that a residential 8 building permit was issued on 10/29/18 along with 9 electrical, HVAC, mechanical, plumbing and roof 10 permits. A residential building permit is set to 11 expire on 1/24/20. On 9/10/19 staff was advised by 12 property owners Carl and Laura Showen (phonetic) 13 that a lien from Gale Insulation, unpaid 14 subcontractor, has been placed on the property in 15 the amount of $2,270. Assistant County Attorney 16 Barbieri located the recorded record of lien filed 17 on 8/22 against the property of 7731 Silver Oak 18 Drive and provided it to us. On 9/11 of '19 a 19 disciplinary letter was served to Mr. Miranda by 20 email sent certified mail, posted and requested to 21 be served by the sheriff's office for not paying 22 the supplier, Gale Insulation. 23 Staff received an email from Group One office 24 assistant Joan Fare (phonetic) containing a 25 response from Mr. Miranda. This is a violation of Page 48 1 section 10-67 revocation or suspension of 2 certificates of competency. Signs a statement with 3 the respect to a project or contract which falsely 4 indicates that the work is bonded, falsely 5 indicates the payment has been made for all 6 subcontracted work, labor and/or materials which 7 results in a financial loss to the owner, purchaser 8 or another contractor, or falsely indicates that 9 workers' compensation and/or public liability 10 insurance are maintained. Therefore, staff is 11 recommending to suspend the permitting privileges 12 of Mr. Michael J. Miranda, Group One Construction 13 and Development, Inc., not to exceed 180 days. 14 MR. DAVIS: My question of staff is we've had 15 a number of homeowners speak this morning and a few 16 vendors or subcontractors, but we only have one 17 complaint that has brought this to us today? 18 MR. CICIO: This is one that we have worked. 19 We have one that we received, I believe, last 20 Thursday, which we are in review of. 21 MR. DAVIS: Okay. And this is for a -- as I 22 read it or heard it, a permit that was issued last 23 year in October, and I guess, it's dragged now for 24 then ten months and the complaint comes in August? 25 MR. CICIO: That is correct. Page 49 1 MR. DAVIS: And a recognition of only one lien 2 against the homeowner filed by Gale Insulation? 3 MR. CICIO: That is correct. 4 MR. DAVIS: So where my confusion is is that 5 the case as the county is presenting it is very 6 narrow as opposed to a broader hearing that we've 7 heard from public comment today that says that this 8 is something much greater than what we're hearing 9 from staff. I just say that as an outspoken thing. 10 I'm surprised that we only have one complaint that 11 this is -- that we haven't received any other 12 complaints from all of this that we heard during 13 the public comment portion. 14 MR. LEONARD: Mr. Chair, maybe I heard in 15 public comments maybe somebody's homes are being 16 built in another municipality of which we don't 17 have jurisdiction over. 18 MR. DAVIS: Okay. That's a valid point. 19 Thank you. I just speak it as I think it. So -- 20 MS. WILLIAMS: Mr. Chairman, the Board also -- 21 we've received phone calls from the citizens but no 22 one ever filed a formal complaint. Only two 23 citizens have, only two I have been working with. 24 Only two formal complaints we've received from our 25 -- Page 50 1 MR. ZRALLACK: Mr. Chairman, I'm sure a good 2 percentage of the general public is not aware that 3 that option is available, filing a formal 4 complaint. 5 MR. DAVIS: So with respect to Mr. Zrallack's 6 comment, I urge each and every one of you to follow 7 this to the end. Make these people pay. We are 8 licensed contractors that sit on this Board. We 9 are professional business people, and believe me 10 when I say this, I -- my skin is crawling listening 11 to you. I feel so bad for each and every one of 12 you and I truly hope that each and every one of you 13 see this through to the end. I make a motion to 14 revoke -- 15 MS. BARBIERI: Mr. Chairman, this is Assistant 16 County Attorney Katherine Barbieri. I think the 17 complainant should have an opportunity to speak. 18 I'm assuming that the contractor is not here, but 19 we need to ask so he can have a chance. We have 20 due process we need to follow and what was said at 21 public hearing is public hearing. So if there's 22 additional evidence that needs to be provided so 23 that it's part of this hearing, then it needs to be 24 part of this hearing. 25 MR. DAVIS: Okay. b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 15 (Pages 51 to 54) Page 51 1 MS. BARBIERI: Thank you. 2 MR. DAVIS: I -- I just brought up the point 3 because we heard so much in public comment to -- to 4 help us as a Board and to help the public who is 5 hear to witness our meeting, we are here for this 6 one complaint. We've heard a broader picture, but 7 we have heard you. But we are restricted to -- our 8 hearing this morning is specific to this complaint. 9 I'm questioning -- because I'm kind of favoring 10 where the motion was going, but maybe I can ask 11 staff and our legal representation if we follow 12 that motion to bypass staff recommendation for the 13 suspension and go for a full revocation, does that 14 need to be based on a broader knowledge of the 15 faults and indiscretions of this particular 16 contractor so that we can -- because revocation is 17 a pretty harsh step, but if we're looking at it in 18 the light of a single context as opposed to a 19 multiplicity of failures, I think we're in more of 20 a standing to be able to make a revocation motion. 21 And do we need -- 22 MS. BARBIERI: Mr. Chairman, Assistant County 23 Attorney Katherine Barbieri, I'm not sure -- I know 24 that notice was provided but you need to look at 25 the notice so that the contractor is -- I don't Page 52 1 know, I assume he's not here. So we'll have to 2 establish that on the record, but we also need to 3 look at the notice, because did the notice put him 4 on notice that he could have his permitting 5 privileges in St. Lucie County competency -- 6 certificate of competency for permitting privileges 7 revoked completely or did it put him on notice that 8 it could be suspended for 180 days? The penalty 9 should not be harsher than the notice that was 10 provided to him, but you could proceed with what 11 staff recommendation is, and then obviously appears 12 there will be more cases and might be brought back 13 to you and at that point the notice could be 14 revocation and then the Board, after hearing it and 15 hearing all of the evidence, may determine that's 16 the appropriate thing. 17 MR. LEONARD: Ms. Barbieri, the reason why I 18 ask that is because based on this case, the 19 information I have provided in front of me, St. 20 Lucie County CCL10-67, it allows this Board to 21 revoke or suspend. 22 MS. BARBIERI: That is within your purview. I 23 just -- if we could see the notice that was 24 provided to him. Did he understand that revocation 25 of his St. Lucie certificate of competency for Page 53 1 permitting privileges could be -- could happen 2 happen today, which he chose not to appear, and if 3 he did not, the harshest penalty he could receive 4 was 180 days suspension, then at this point, 5 legal's recommendation -- after hearing everything 6 from the complainant -- so you need to have the 7 hearing first. So we're talking about things 8 without having the hearing which makes me 9 uncomfortable. After having the hearing, if you 10 decide you want to do that, then I would go with 11 the harshest he was on notice with and have another 12 hearing. 13 MR. LEONARD: Thank you. 14 MS. BARBIERI: Thank you. 15 MR. DAVIS: Do you have that document, a copy 16 there of that that would share with us then exactly 17 what was presented to the contractor? 18 MS. WILLIAMS: According to the letter he 19 received, it says on the bottom, the Board shall 20 have the power to revoke, suspend or deny the 21 issuance of renewal certificate of competency if 22 determined that the contractor has committed any of 23 the above. 24 MR. ZRALLACK: And, Mr. Chair, that was 25 provided to us in our packet. Page 54 1 MS. BARBIERI: So then he is on notice. 2 MR. DAVIS: All right. So then we have the 3 option to be able to take that motion that 4 Mr. Leonard was preparing to give, we have that 5 option this morning. He's been put on notice. He 6 should be here. And as the chairman, I will ask 7 for the second time, is the contractor Michael 8 Miranda here and would like to speak? And I'm sure 9 with the audience that's here, if he was, we would 10 know, and he's not. 11 MS. BARBIERI: However, I would suggest you 12 let the complainant speak that actually issued the 13 complaint that we're here today. I believe they 14 should be on the record. 15 MR. DAVIS: Okay. So the complainants being a 16 Carl and Laurie Showen; is that correct? Okay. 17 Thank you for being here today. If you'd be sworn 18 in by the recording secretary, please. 19 MS. JOHNSON: State your name. 20 MS. SHOWEN: Laurie Showen. 21 MR. SHOWEN: Carl Showen. 22 MS. JOHNSON: Do you affirm to tell the truth, 23 the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? 24 MS. SHOWEN: Yes. 25 MR. SHOWEN: I do. b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 16 (Pages 55 to 58) Page 55 1 MS. JOHNSON: Thank you. 2 MR. DAVIS: Good morning. 3 MR. SHOWEN: Good morning. And I want to say 4 ahead of time I thank you-all. I had no idea you 5 guys were volunteers. So I would thank you ahead 6 of time for your time. We own the home and the 7 property for which the lien has come upon. And we 8 also have four other notices of intent to lien our 9 home from work that has been done, draws that have 10 been made, but the contractors have not been paid. 11 So I understand that the lien is not public 12 knowledge at this time, but I have notices of 13 intent to lien my home. And I've spoken with each 14 and every one of these companies and they are going 15 to lien our home as they did with the rest of the 16 group here. 17 MR. DAVIS: Just to clarify as we go, if you 18 don't mind -- 19 MR. SHOWEN: Yes, sir. 20 MR. DAVIS: These are draw requests that have 21 been given to you and you have made payment on 22 those draws? 23 MR. SHOWEN: No, sir. What I'm stating is we 24 obtained a draw schedule and what has been drawn -- 25 I'm with Seacoast Bank -- along loan, and what has Page 56 1 been drawn, what Mike Miranda from Group One 2 Construction has received, and then what has been 3 actually paid to the contractors. Do you 4 understand what I'm saying? He's actually received 5 money for the work that has been performed yet has 6 not paid. 7 MS. SHOWEN: The contractor. 8 MR. SHOWEN: The contractor. So I have a -- 9 for instance, I have a $12,200 roof bill that's for 10 a roofer, you know? And, I mean, bottom line the 11 only way I got that roof done is I had to plead and 12 beg that contractor to finish my roof because they 13 went in and installed insulation in my home knowing 14 -- and it wasn't the company's fault, not Gale 15 Insulation, which is the lien I have, but they 16 installed this insulation in my home. And Mike 17 Miranda, knowing -- fully knowing that there was 18 water pouring in my home. 19 MS. SHOWEN: The roof was leak ing. 20 MR. SHOWEN: And we came back and we were out 21 of town at the time and we came back and had 22 insulation that was falling from the ceiling in 23 every direction. You know, we have video, 24 pictures, all of the evidence, you know, as 25 required. Furthermore, I have notices of intent to Page 57 1 lien for the dumpster, notice of intent to lien for 2 the porta potty, which I heard another gentleman 3 say he did not attempt to help secure it. I went 4 over there personally and secured my home and 5 "two-by-foured" the doors and what not. But I have 6 tried to contact this gentleman. I call him and 7 you cannot leave a message because his voicemail is 8 continually full. I email and text him nonstop and 9 he will about every three weeks to a month give a 10 two to three word response on any of the matters 11 that are going on with my personal -- our personal 12 home. I'm a US Submarine Corp disabled vet and I 13 get my living from my pension. I don't have the 14 money to -- to finish my home. 15 MS. SHOWEN: It's extremely stressful. 16 MR. SHOWEN: So I have obtained -- excuse me 17 -- I have obtained what it is going to cost to 18 finish my home, and at this point, I don't know 19 where we're going to get the money, but hopefully 20 through God's grace we're going to get this money. 21 But the bottom line is this gentleman is stealing 22 money and he's taking advantage of people and I'm 23 hoping that this day is the first step to getting 24 something done and we all had hopes here if you -- 25 if this Board has the power to revoke this man's Page 58 1 license at the least, and we will pursue with the 2 police what is in their power to put this man in 3 jail. 4 MR. DAVIS: The one thing I wanted to make 5 sure I understood is a notice to owner is one 6 thing, but an actual filing of the lien is another 7 thing. So right now there's an actual lien filed 8 by Gale Insulation and is there anyone else that 9 has filed lien at this point? 10 MS. SHOWEN: There is but it's just not in the 11 system yet. 12 MR. SHOWEN: Yes, actually, I have the notice 13 to owner and I believe the lien from the roofer, 14 but he hasn't filed it. He's actually giving me an 15 opportunity to deal with the bank personally which 16 I have emailed his -- emailed his information for 17 the bank to pay it, but they -- you know, we're 18 stuck between a rock and a hard place here. We 19 can't have the bank pay it if the contractor has to 20 be responsible for requesting those funds. And if 21 you can't get ahold of the contractor, I mean, what 22 do we do? And then it goes to the next step where 23 they start suing us. And then that's all another 24 -- you know, I've had to hire an attorney. I'm not 25 here to preach or anything -- b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 17 (Pages 59 to 62) Page 59 1 MR. DAVIS: I just ask because the liens 2 itself are solid proof of nonpayment. And I know 3 that your subs have a certain time frame that they 4 have to file lien or else they lose the 5 opportunity. So if they are out there and they are 6 looking for money, you are definitely going to want 7 to encourage them to go ahead and do that I think 8 to their advantage. And it helps state your case. 9 I'm curious, you know, how many of these are out 10 there. We now know of two. One that is a for sure 11 and one that is in the works according to your 12 testimony. Anything else outstanding that you're 13 aware of there? 14 MR. SHOWEN: What I am aware of that's 15 outstanding, if you would like me to state it, is 16 the roofer $12,200. I have his invoice here. I 17 have his notice of intent to lien. I have the 18 dumpster removal and dumpster which has been left 19 there, and by the way, this contractor has not been 20 to my property -- I just want to make sure I'm 100 21 percent here, it's been at least two or 22 two-and-a-half months that he just hasn't worked on 23 my home. Nothing. Nothing whatsoever. I have the 24 dumpster that's there. They are charging me a day 25 -- excuse me, a monthly amount which they have Page 60 1 informed me that I'm going to have to now pay this 2 out of my pocket to have it removed. They will not 3 remove it until it is paid. I don't have $3,000 4 just to pull out, and that's the porta potty as 5 well. They charge a monthly fee as well and they 6 will not remove it until the bill is paid. And I 7 can't pay the bill. They also have a notice of 8 intent to lien my home. So, yes, roofer, dumpster, 9 porta potty, Gale Insulation. 10 MS. SHOWEN: Stuart Paint & Supply. 11 MR. SHOWEN: Stuart Paint & Supply, $163. I'm 12 nowhere near where a lot of these unfortunate 13 people are. It's serious amounts of money, but to 14 be $120,000 is a life load of money. So -- yes, 15 that's what's going on. I have now presented what 16 -- who the companies are, how much they are 17 intending to lien my home for. I'm just hoping 18 with this meeting there is something that can be 19 done. 20 MR. DAVIS: Thank you. Any questions of the 21 Showens from the Board? 22 MR. JERGER: I have a question. 23 MR. DAVIS: Mr. Jerger. 24 MR. JERGER: So you're saying that the bank is 25 holding the money or did Mike Miranda take the Page 61 1 money from the bank in order to pay the 2 subcontractors, or do the banks still have the 3 money to where you can hire another contractor and 4 finish your house? 5 MR. SHOWEN: The -- what I have right now, I 6 have what the bank has told me approximately 7 $119,000 left in the loan to finish the home. I've 8 got another contractor to give me a price on 9 finishing my home. As you're aware, it's been 10 quite some time and I no longer have the money to 11 completely finish my home. The 119 will not cover 12 the cost to finish my home. As far as whether the 13 money has actually been in Mike Miranda's hands 14 from the bank, I have a draw schedule from what we 15 read of it, and I've tried to get in contact with 16 the bank for them to explain it further to us, yes, 17 he has received some money to pay contractors that 18 have not been paid. We are not 100 percent 19 confirmed whether he's received all of this money. 20 Now, he hasn't been able to make his third 21 draw from my loan because we needed to do something 22 to protect the only money that we have because we 23 can't -- if we -- after hearing horror stories, 24 people have contacted us asking us -- and I get a 25 call once a week from a different person if I'm Page 62 1 having the same problem with this contractor that 2 they are. And after we speak, I realize I need to 3 take care of my family and stop the payments before 4 I lose -- have no money to finish the home. And so 5 that's what we acquired through speaking with these 6 people with their money being stolen, just 7 completely taken. 8 MS. SHOWEN: And just so we're clear, a lot of 9 these people that are hear somehow got, like, my 10 number and my husband's number and people just 11 started calling and everyone, "Are you having a 12 problem? Are you having a problem?" "Oh, my 13 gosh." Da-da-da. So there's numerous -- it's not, 14 you know, just us. So they were calling me. Of 15 course, I'd call back and find out what's going on, 16 and then, you know -- 17 MR. DAVIS: You do have a bank loan for this 18 draw request and the draw requests are going 19 through the bank? 20 MS. SHOWEN: Seacoast, correct. 21 MR. SHOWEN: Yes. 22 MR. DAVIS: So the bank typically in an 23 agreement like that would have an inspector that 24 takes a draw request and then does an inspection 25 and verifies your percentages of completion for a b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 18 (Pages 63 to 66) Page 63 1 variety of those tasks that are broken out to the 2 sum are verifiably completed and then -- and only 3 then do they go ahead and release that money. So 4 right now you're not really sure exactly the 5 position of the bank with the most recent draw and 6 whether those moneys are due and payable or not? 7 MR. SHOWEN: I'm going to have to say no, 8 we're not 100 percent sure on what money has -- 9 that Mike Miranda has received from the bank in his 10 hand. 11 MR. DAVIS: Yeah. I think that would be 12 important information. 13 MS. SHOWEN: I think we know, but we're not 14 100 percent -- 15 MR. SHOWEN: We don't want to say anything 16 because I don't want to sit here and say he's 17 received, you know, 9 percent of this draw, which 18 we have those percents, but they are not broken 19 down to us as far as the amount of money. It only 20 says a percentage of the draw. Now, whether he's 21 received it personally, I can't say that. So -- 22 but I know I have liens on my home for work that 23 has been performed and contractors that haven't 24 been paid. 25 MR. DAVIS: Any other -- Page 64 1 MR. SHOWEN: And just to clarify what I'm 2 doing here, I'm trying to see if -- well, we just 3 wanted to file this and we're trying and have been 4 trying to get out of our contract. All we want to 5 do is finish our home. 6 MS. SHOWEN: A lot of us. 7 MR. SHOWEN: That's all we want to do. We 8 don't want to sue this guy. I mean, I had to hire 9 a lawyer. I had to borrow money from my mother to 10 do that. But, you know, we just want to finish our 11 home and be released from our contract. I've tried 12 to contact this man and tell him just release us 13 from our contract so that we may finish our home 14 and he won't do it. 15 MS. SHOWEN: And there's numerous of us that 16 want to just be released. 17 MR. SHOWEN: Yeah. I mean, we personally, we 18 don't want to go to court. We don't want to sue 19 him. We're not saying that he's stolen our money 20 from us. We have been fortunate that he hasn't 21 stolen from us as far as we know. 22 MS. SHOWEN: Because we're through the bank. 23 MR. SHOWEN: Because we're through the bank. 24 We just want to finish our home and want to be 25 released from our contract. I believe we should be Page 65 1 entitled to that. It's been almost -- it's been 2 almost 18 years -- excuse me, 18 months going on up 3 to two years, which I have dates when certain 4 things were signed and I also have a schedule in 5 which he gave to us on when certain things were 6 going to be done. I was supposed to have my CO on 7 July 2nd or July 3rd. 8 MS. SHOWEN: June 10th. 9 MR. SHOWEN: Okay. June 10th. I have the 10 dates here. I have a third of a house built. So 11 this is where we're at and we're hoping you can 12 help us. 13 MR. DAVIS: Any other questions of the 14 Showens? 15 MR. LEONARD: What was the total loan for the 16 house? 17 MR. SHOWEN: The total loan was for $243,000, 18 and we -- my wife put up her 401K, $20,000 to buy 19 the land, and I also put up $21,000 at closing. 20 MR. LEONARD: Thank you. 21 MR. SHOWEN: You're welcome. 22 MR. DAVIS: Any other questions? 23 MR. SHOWEN: I'm sorry, I need to re -- I put 24 $14,000 at closing. I gave him a $7,000 deposit. 25 So it's a total of 21. Page 66 1 MR. DAVIS: All right. Thank you very much. 2 We may need to pull you back up. 3 MS. WILLIAMS: Mr. Chairman of the board, 4 Mr. Miranda has come in. Mr. Miranda is here. 5 MR. DAVIS: Very good. Thank you. All right. 6 I want to just go back to staff before we call 7 Mr. Miranda to come forward. In the violation as 8 it's given to us -- 9 MS. BARBIERI: Mr. Chairman, can I just say 10 this for the record, it's my understanding that 11 Mr. Miranda arrived at approximately 9:50. I just 12 wanted that on the record. 13 MR. DAVIS: Okay. Thank you. To follow up 14 the testimony we just received from the Showens, 15 concerning the violation as staff has recorded it, 16 it talks about statements that are signed that 17 falsely -- falsely indicates that the work is 18 bonded, falsely indicates that the payment has been 19 made for all subcontracted work, of course, that's 20 like a release. Are those documents that are 21 specific between the contractor and the bank? 22 These statements that are being referred to in the 23 violation. "Signs a statement with respect to a 24 project or contract which falsely indicates that 25 the work is bonded, falsely indicates that payment b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 19 (Pages 67 to 70) Page 67 1 has been made for all subcontractor work, labor 2 and/or materials which results in a financial loss 3 to the owner," and so on. What are these 4 statements that are being referred to? 5 MS. WILLIAMS: Because the lien was placed 6 against the property owner for not being paid, 7 that's the only section we have, which he did not 8 -- payment has not been made to all subcontracting 9 work. That's the section we got to cite him 10 because he didn't pay his subcontractors and a lien 11 was placed. I guess the statement would be the 12 lien that was recorded -- 13 MR. DAVIS: So that would be a release of a 14 lien that the contractor executed and gave to the 15 bank with the draw request? 16 MS. WILLIAMS: Because he didn't pay for the 17 work done, they had insulation place a lien against 18 their property, and because the lien was recorded 19 we're saying he did not pay his subcontractors. 20 That's why a lien was placed against the property 21 owners. And then once Miranda, if he does pay that 22 lien, then the lien would be released. 23 MR. DAVIS: I'm still not sure that you've 24 answered my question about what the statement is 25 that's being referred to here. Page 68 1 MS. WILLIAMS: I guess the statement would be 2 the recorded lien. I'm thinking the statement 3 would be. And if Katherine can -- 4 MR. DAVIS: Because what it says in violation 5 that it's stating -- I assume that it's referring 6 to the contractor signed a statement with respect 7 to a project or contract so I'd just -- I'm trying 8 to verify what statement are we referring to? 9 MS. WILLIAMS: I guess it would be the work 10 agreement from the property owner -- when you do a 11 contract between a property owner and Mr. Miranda, 12 he signed a work agreement saying how he would 13 perform all work and pay all subcontractors. He 14 has not. 15 MR. DAVIS: Okay. So that would be like a 16 release of lien then that he then -- so it's a 17 document that he provided with his draw requests to 18 the homeowner? 19 MS. WILLIAMS: The contract he signed between 20 him and the property owner states that -- 21 MR. DAVIS: Okay. So this is just a 22 subcontractors agreement. Okay. All right. Any 23 other questions of staff? Okay. Now that I've 24 been notified Mr. Miranda, Michael Miranda is here, 25 Mr. Miranda if you'd like to come to the podium and Page 69 1 be sworn in by the recording secretary. 2 MS. JOHNSON: Hi. State your name for the 3 record. 4 MR. MIRANDA: Michael Miranda. 5 MS. JOHNSON: Do you affirm to tell the truth, 6 the whole truth, and nothing but the truth? 7 MR. MIRANDA: Yes, ma'am. 8 MS. JOHNSON: Thank you. 9 MR. DAVIS: Good morning. 10 MR. MIRANDA: Good morning. Sorry I was late. 11 I had a little car trouble. 12 MR. DAVIS: So you missed a lot of testimony 13 there. I guess you got the last 12, 13 minutes. 14 You were noticed concerning the meeting and the 15 violation that has been charged against you I 16 assume. So without having heard all of the 17 testimony that we've heard, at least you know the 18 violation and the charge. So we're here to hear 19 you and we appreciate you coming. 20 MR. MIRANDA: Well -- thank you. Well, as we 21 wrote -- we wrote back to you guys about -- about 22 the draw. Mr. Showen asked us not to go to the 23 house anymore. He was going to cancel the 24 contract, which is fine. Okay? But I didn't put 25 in the draw to pay the last people that are due. Page 70 1 And we also sent in the last draw that we got from 2 the bank, you guys have read that, and we marked 3 off what we got paid for. And it's a percentage 4 draw of what we do. We work it and we get paid for 5 it. Okay? And at that time, Gale Insulation was 6 the next one to get paid on that job. Now, they -- 7 they weren't -- they filed the lien because of what 8 was going on, all the scuttle butt and all of the 9 talk, talk, talk, and, you know, there was people 10 that were going around to other people that caused 11 more contracts to be canceled. Okay? 12 False statements were made and we had no 13 problem with finishing the Showens' house. It was 14 not a problem. Okay? We were ready to call for 15 the next draw and the next step would be stucco 16 drywall. And then, of course, there's -- there's 17 the Florida lien law where they have to lien on a 18 certain period of time. So if people are going to 19 tell Gale Insulation -- you know, they are not 20 going to get paid, then of course, they are going 21 file a lien on the property. So we -- our contract 22 with the Showens and we're not out of contract with 23 them. We have plenty of time to finish their 24 house. And you could say 16 months, well, we did 25 sign the contract for them to build the house where b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 20 (Pages 71 to 74) Page 71 1 we had stuff to go through in order to get to that 2 point to the permit, like getting drawings done. 3 We also had to dig a pond on his property, and all 4 of that takes time. 5 And our contract is 12 months after the 6 building permit. Now, this -- at this time, not -- 7 we still have about three months to finish the 8 house and we still have money in the budget. We're 9 not upside down. You know, I didn't take any money 10 on this job and pay something else. You know, it's 11 all -- it's a good job, really, but -- of course, 12 the homeowners want to be in immediately. You 13 know? They want to be in immediately. And it's 14 not fast enough. They don't bother reading the 15 contract, and you know, I've also done extra work 16 on that property and I haven't charged them. I 17 built a car -- we did some demo work from the 18 garage to the house, the walkway was too small and 19 it had a covered patio. I took it down and built 20 in and, you know, I did some other stuff for them 21 and -- but like I said, as far as the liens go, we 22 would have paid them. We didn't get the last -- we 23 didn't get the last draw. 24 MR. DAVIS: Let me ask you a question on that, 25 because the ones that have been brought to our Page 72 1 attention are the insulation sub, the roofing 2 contractor, and there's a dumpster that has an 3 outstanding invoice. Now, it was made mentioned 4 that the insulation was installed and actually now 5 has been damaged because I guess the roof was 6 incomplete or was improperly installed and so the 7 water came through and damaged the insulation. So 8 if that's the case, that's telling me that the 9 insulation has been installed and the roof hasn't 10 been either installed or started. So those are 11 expenses that you have made draw requests for, 12 correct? 13 MR. MIRANDA: No. We didn't make -- 14 MR. DAVIS: You've not drawn for the work? 15 MR. MIRANDA: No. 16 MR. DAVIS: Why not? 17 MR. MIRANDA: We -- well, yes. Well, there 18 was a period of time where we had a lot of rain. 19 Okay? We had rain every single day, it rained 20 hard. So it was raining, you know, and they, 21 Treasure Coast Roofing, had the roof dried in. 22 Okay. So, of course, we keep wanting to go and go 23 and go and the roof was dried in. And we -- we 24 asked them to put shingles on the roof so it would 25 be all tight. At the same time we ordered, you Page 73 1 know, the insulation, and somehow or another the 2 shingles got delayed and there was a leak, but 3 there was a leak in one spot and we fixed it. And 4 we took out the window that was wet. It was bad 5 insulation. And we replaced it. 6 MR. DAVIS: But that work is complete? 7 MR. MIRANDA: It's complete. Yes. 8 MR. DAVIS: And I know those subs are wanting 9 payment -- 10 MR. MIRANDA: Yes. 11 MR. DAVIS: But you've not requested payment 12 from the bank for those completed parts of the 13 project? 14 MR. MIRANDA: No. Because -- 15 MR. DAVIS: That's where I'm getting confused. 16 MR. MIRANDA: No, because Mr. Showen asked us 17 -- said that he was going to cancel us. 18 MR. DAVIS: Well, whether he cancels you or 19 not, you still are liable for payment on 20 subcontractor agreements that you've established. 21 MR. MIRANDA: You're right. You're absolutely 22 right. 23 MR. DAVIS: And then that leads to liens when 24 you don't do that. So, I mean, I don't understand 25 why you're not drawing for those things and paying Page 74 1 for those things. 2 MR. MIRANDA: Because they -- they have to say 3 to the bank, pay them. And he asked me not to do 4 that. 5 MR. DAVIS: They have to what? 6 MR. MIRANDA: When the bank calls -- when I 7 request a draw, they have to get -- the homeowner 8 has to sign off on it. Okay? If he's canceling my 9 deal, it's canceled. Okay? If I call the bank and 10 say, "Hey, give me money." "Let's do an 11 inspection," and they will send out an inspector, 12 and it comes down to okay you'll have to pay this 13 person and this person and we'll give you the 14 money. Okay? But that inspection, if it happens, 15 all this happens, and they don't release that 16 money, then this money cannot go to the subs. 17 MR. DAVIS: Okay. You're saying that for 18 whatever reason the owner opted not to sign the 19 document that the bank created that was approving 20 the release of funds as you had drawn for funds? 21 MR. MIRANDA: Well, he wouldn't sign because 22 he had canceled the deal. 23 MR. DAVIS: But that would be to his detriment 24 because he doesn't want the liens, he doesn't want 25 incomplete work. b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 21 (Pages 75 to 78) Page 75 1 MR. MIRANDA: Well, we could -- I could call 2 the bank and do that. We could call the bank and 3 have the inspector out there. 4 MR. DAVIS: That just doesn't make sense to 5 me. So do you have anything like that to show me 6 that that's the case what's holding up payment is 7 that it's the owner's responsibility to sign a 8 document that the bank has presented them? 9 MR. MIRANDA: Well, if I'm not the contractor 10 on that job and I'm canceled, okay, he wrote us a 11 letter that he canceled the job. Those liens came 12 on after he canceled us. 13 MR. DAVIS: But it's work that you gave 14 approval to proceed with and you're duly liable to 15 pay for that work to your vendors and to your -- 16 MR. MIRANDA: I have no problem paying these 17 subcontractors as long as the bank -- you know, we 18 work on draws. If the bank gives the draw, I'll 19 pay it. Simple as that. 20 MR. DAVIS: Something just doesn't smell right 21 there because it's draw request -- I think if you 22 want to state that case, you somehow have to show 23 us that there's a burden on the owner that the 24 owner has not made good on, which if you're saying 25 it's just because the owner hadn't signed the bank Page 76 1 document that says, yes, I agree with you to 2 release these moneys to my constructor, it just 3 doesn't make sense to me and I'd like to see that. 4 MR. MIRANDA: Okay. We could -- I'll call for 5 a bank draw. I will call for a bank draw today. 6 MR. DAVIS: They are saying you have already 7 made that draw and that the bank has it ready to 8 pay it's just that the owner hasn't signed his line 9 saying, yes, release my money to my contractor to 10 make sure these things are paid for. That's what I 11 think I heard you say. 12 MR. MIRANDA: We could have called for that 13 and the lien is just -- the insulation, it was 14 $2,200 and we have it in the draw to get -- we 15 didn't get the money, A. Okay? It's not a 16 problem. Okay. It's not a problem. We just have 17 to call up and get it. Now, if the Showens will 18 release the draw, that's fine. So you will not 19 release the draw? (Inaudible). 20 MR. DAVIS: Let's keep the conversation to the 21 one at the podium because that's all the mic is 22 going to pick up and I know this can break into 23 chaos if we let it. Let's try not to do that to 24 keep it a little more organized, please. 25 MR. MIRANDA: The Showens job is a good job to Page 77 1 me. I mean, we're not upside down there. We have 2 the money to pay. Okay. We have it to pay. It's 3 just the situation. And there's other issues but 4 I'm not going to go through that with the Showens. 5 The only thing at this point is if the money is 6 released from the bank we would pay and they would 7 have no liens on their house and life goes on, we 8 finish the house. 9 MR. DAVIS: All right. 10 MS. WILLIAMS: Mr. Chairman of the Board, in 11 your package is a copy of -- I guess, Seacoast Bank 12 that talks about the draws in your package. 13 MR. MIRANDA: Yeah, we sent the draw schedule 14 to you and you can see if you look on there what 15 we've got paid already and what's due. 16 MR. DAVIS: Is that in -- no, that's a 17 different packet. Any other questions of 18 Mr. Miranda while I'm fumbling through my 19 paperwork? I'm going to go back to the violation 20 as it's recorded and given to us as a licensing 21 board. So, Mr. Miranda, you've read it. It says 22 that you have signed a document that falsely 23 indicates that the work has been done and the 24 payments have been made. So that's a release of 25 lien, I'm sure. And then it does -- goes on and Page 78 1 says -- this is the other part that I haven't 2 brought up yet but it says that you have signed the 3 document that falsely indicates that workman's 4 compensation and/or public liability insurances are 5 maintained. So I guess that is something our staff 6 is saying that you -- I want to ask you. Do you 7 have current insurance coverages for your general 8 liability and your workman's compensation? 9 MR. MIRANDA: When I spoke to somebody at the 10 county about, you know, what was the charge here 11 today -- okay -- because that's a standard -- you 12 know, that sentence is a standard form that you 13 guys -- it's something that you would bring up and 14 you would charge me for that. So when I asked them 15 what is the charge, what am I looking at. And they 16 were worried about the liens. That was it. And 17 the other stuff on there, like if I'm bonded to 18 project and whatever else was said on that had 19 really nothing to do with the situation. It's a 20 standard -- what the county writes up on that 21 incident is what I was told. 22 MR. DAVIS: My question, though, is about your 23 insurance coverages. 24 MR. MIRANDA: Yeah, I have insurance. 25 MR. DAVIS: Workman's comp, you have current b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 22 (Pages 79 to 82) Page 79 1 coverage? 2 MR. MIRANDA: Yes. 3 MR. DAVIS: And also with general liability 4 and automotive, you have all those coverages? 5 MR. MIRANDA: Yeah. 6 MR. DAVIS: Okay. So it says -- 7 MR. MIRANDA: I've been in business since '03, 8 okay? I have insurance. I have all that stuff. I 9 mean, you know, I don't work without no insurance. 10 MR. DAVIS: Any other questions of 11 Mr. Miranda? Anything else you'd like to share 12 with us right now, Mr. Miranda? 13 MR. MIRANDA: Yeah, but I think it's better 14 not to. I have other stuff going on. 15 MR. DAVIS: Okay. It does appear that the 16 homeowner would like to speak again, but I don't 17 know what the Board's opinion is, but I'm just 18 really baffled. There is a contractual 19 relationship between you and the homeowner. You in 20 turn create sub-contractual relationships and 21 engage them in the work of which work is completed, 22 and should have been drawn for, and released by the 23 bank so that you in turn pay those vendors and 24 subs. And there is no lien. But somehow that -- 25 there's a -- there's a disengagement where Page 80 1 something didn't happen and -- and you -- what I 2 heard you say and where I'm confused is that the 3 draw request was made but the homeowner didn't -- 4 oh, okay, you've not even drawn for those sales 5 that would even be further confusion for me because 6 -- 7 MR. MIRANDA: Let me explain it to you. 8 Before the liens are filed on that property, okay, 9 we were able to call in for a draw. When 10 Mr. Showen said to us, "Mike, we're going to cancel 11 the--the contract. Don't do anymore work." Okay? 12 So what -- what happens, if I went and called the 13 bank and they have talked to -- Grace at Seacoast 14 Bank, okay, they would not release the funds. They 15 would not release them. So if I call, you 16 understand, I would call to get this draw, okay? I 17 think that the subs need to be paid. They should 18 be paid. They filed the lien because it's Florida 19 statute they have to. Okay? And as soon as they 20 are paid, the liens would be off. Now, I did not 21 call on this job to get the money because 22 Mr. Showen canceled us. He canceled us. 23 MR. DAVIS: That doesn't make sense. 24 MR. JERGER: Yeah, it doesn't make any sense. 25 MR. MIRANDA: Why? I had dates when he Page 81 1 canceled us -- 2 MR. DAVIS: Because nobody, the bank, the 3 owner, and you as a contractor don't want liens to 4 be filed and exactly what you just said only 5 precipitates in liens being filed, but you should 6 -- you should draw for the work complete, you 7 should receive money for the work complete, you 8 should pay for the work complete, and then the only 9 process works the way it's intended to. 10 MR. MIRANDA: You're right. I could -- like I 11 said, we didn't do that -- 12 MR. DAVIS: And you're trying to claim that 13 the owner is upset with you and has decided to 14 break the contract -- 15 MR. MIRANDA: Yes. 16 MR. DAVIS: -- and so I'm not going to draw 17 for that and I'm just going to let it all go to 18 heck. 19 MR. MIRANDA: No, I that's -- well, no. No. 20 I'm sorry. 21 MR. DAVIS: Correct me then, because that's 22 exactly what I'm hearing and what I understand. 23 MR. MIRANDA: This is -- this is my job. I 24 would not want this to happen. There's no way that 25 I would want this to happen. If the money is Page 82 1 there, why would I not want to pay? If I could 2 call the bank and get the draw, the inspector would 3 come out there and say, yes, you got insulation 4 done, you got the roof done, you've got windows in, 5 and if anything that's on that list, we would be 6 paid for. And I would sign and on that situation, 7 I would sign that these people were paid for. But 8 it didn't happen because before the liens were 9 filed -- this is before the liens were filed, 10 Mr. Showen canceled the contract on us. Canceled 11 it. Okay? Now, it was his -- now, he could 12 collect the money on this, he would have to get a 13 new contractor. And the liens, the bank would pay, 14 and at that point, they would -- the bank would go 15 out and pay them, pay whoever the contractor is. 16 MR. DAVIS: So I'm a general contractor so 17 that still didn't make sense to me. Okay. 18 (Inaudible) -- Mr. Miranda because I know we're 19 going to go around that tree three times now. I've 20 heard you and you've heard me and we don't 21 understand each other. 22 MR. MIRANDA: Mr. Davis, you're a general 23 contractor, correct? 24 MR. DAVIS: Yes, sir. 25 MR. MIRANDA: Okay. So when you want money b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 23 (Pages 83 to 86) Page 83 1 from the bank to pay the subs, do you not call the 2 bank for a bank inspection? 3 MR. DAVIS: That's just part of the bank's 4 responsibility when I submit the draw request and 5 they automatically go and they do their inspection 6 and make a report. 7 MR. MIRANDA: And they make a report. Does 8 the -- does the owner have to sign off on that, 9 that it's okay? 10 MR. LEONARD: Excuse me, Mr. Chair? I'd like 11 to make a motion to go ahead and suspend Michael 12 Miranda's certificate of competency in St. Lucie 13 County. 14 MR. DAVIS: I think we do need to really do 15 this -- Miranda, let's let him have the proper 16 hearing. I think counsel has suggested that and I 17 know, maybe, some of us need to get some where but 18 this is our community responsibility that we 19 volunteered for. I apologize, Mr. Leonard. 20 MR. LEONARD: That's okay. I have all the 21 time in the world, Chair. 22 MR. DAVIS: Well, I don't. But I'm going to 23 give it anyway. So going back to your question, 24 Mr. Miranda, when a bank does an inspection and 25 they have agreed to certain completions of work, Page 84 1 what else is required to release the money? 2 MR. MIRANDA: The owner's signature. 3 MR. DAVIS: Well, the owner -- it's to the 4 owner's advantage to sign it so this -- so these 5 vendors and subcontractors are being paid. And 6 that's why that particular statement that you're 7 making, it only brings harm to them and it brings 8 harm to you and it wastes our time. 9 MS. BARBIERI: Mr. Chair, this is a hearing, 10 and we would ask people that if they want to speak, 11 they are going to have to be sworn in at the 12 podium. 13 MR. ZRALLACK: Mr. Chair, the violation that's 14 in front of us as the licensing board -- 15 MR. DAVIS: Yes. Go ahead. 16 MR. ZRALLACK: I believe that we have evidence 17 that -- that is an accurate violation and that's 18 all we're being asked to move on today. Staff may 19 request to revisit this and shelf this for another 20 meeting but we need to stick to the violation 21 that's in front of us today. 22 MR. DAVIS: And just for clarification of 23 those that are in the audience, would you mind 24 rereading the violation that's brought to us today 25 and then we can go from that. Page 85 1 MR. CICIO: Signs a statement with respect to 2 a project or a contract which falsely indicates 3 that the work is bonded, falsely indicates that 4 payment has been made for all subcontracted work, 5 labor, and/or materials which results in a 6 financial loss to the owner, purchaser, or another 7 contractor, or falsely indicates that worker's 8 compensation and/or public liability insurance are 9 maintained. 10 MR. DAVIS: Okay. All right. And so if you 11 would from that, do you have a motion you said 12 you'd like to make? 13 UNKNOWN MALE: I first would like to ask staff 14 if they would want to reconsider if additional 15 violations are warranted based on testimony or they 16 want more time to investigate that before we 17 proceed with the motion. 18 MR. DAVIS: Okay. And that's a good point, 19 because I think that's a point that I had brought 20 up previously that we had heard so much in the 21 public comment's section that I thought if we rated 22 a -- a penalty based on the narrowness of this, 23 that we may shortchange the charge -- you know, the 24 penalty that we want to apply. 25 MR. CICIO: And I understand that that may Page 86 1 delay what, I think, we all would like to move 2 forward with, but the violation that's in front of 3 us today does not appear to be the full scope on 4 this case. 5 MR. DAVIS: Would it be fair to do a 6 suspension with the intent of gathering further 7 information to rehear at our next meeting for the 8 possible consideration of revocation as a further 9 step? 10 MR. ZRALLACK: I believe that's a question for 11 staff or legal. 12 MR. DAVIS: Is that the intent of your comment 13 though -- 14 MR. ZRALLACK: Yes. 15 MR. DAVIS: -- that we have a limited amount 16 of information here, we'd like to maybe go further, 17 but we don't feel comfortable in doing that until 18 we gather more information and put it to our next 19 board meeting. 20 MR. ZRALLACK: That's correct. 21 MR. DAVIS: Okay. 22 MR. LANGEL: And also, Mr. Chairman, if we 23 could, if we can also have -- he says he has 24 insurance on everybody, if he can also -- if he can 25 show proof of insurance if this proceeds further. b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 24 (Pages 87 to 90) Page 87 1 MR. DAVIS: All right. 2 MR. HUDSPETH: And I don't know if we're 3 allowed to take public comment into consideration 4 for this particular case or if that has to be 5 brought before us officially in a citation as well. 6 MR. DAVIS: I think that we've heard that. I 7 do think that if we're going to bring this to our 8 next board meeting, after we've gathered more 9 information, I think that that probably would be 10 something that we'd hear again to back up what 11 we're hearing in a broader scale, which is what 12 we're asking for to give time to create the broader 13 scale if there is such a thing. And so, legal 14 counsel, on our option for this morning, if we have 15 an option. 16 MS. BARBIERI: The option is for you to make a 17 ruling on what's before you, but I know it's rather 18 narrow. So based on that, if right now if you feel 19 the motion be for suspension and/or, you know, 20 obviously, have to decide if you're doing a 21 referral to the state licensing board, that you 22 could also indicate -- instruct staff, not part of 23 that motion, but a separate, just to, you know, 24 investigate any of the allegations that need to be 25 brought before this Board. Page 88 1 MR. DAVIS: All right. 2 MS. BARBIERI: And if they are, then please 3 bring them back, you know. So I think it would be 4 two steps. Right now, your motion needs to be 5 strictly on what is before you right now, but then 6 you could further instruct them later to 7 investigate further. 8 MR. LEONARD: Ms. Barbieri, I have a question 9 for you. 10 MS. BARBIERI: Yes, sir. 11 MR. LEONARD: Based on the letter that 12 Mr. Miranda was provided, the maximum penalty we 13 can do is a revocation or suspension of his 14 license, but we cannot make a reference to the DPPR 15 based on the letter he was provided? 16 MS. BARBIERI: It is not part of the notice. 17 MR. LEONARD: Thank you. 18 MR. DAVIS: All right. Shall I -- 19 MR. SHOWEN: (Inaudible). 20 MR. DAVIS: Sure. Want me to put my little 21 timer on? I just try to bring lightheartedness to 22 this event. I'm sorry. 23 MR. SHOWEN: I just want to state my name 24 again. Carl Showen. Real quick, he stated that he 25 was not able to pay this lien, the insulation, Page 89 1 because I had -- I had fired him. The insulation 2 was installed on July 5th. The very first text, 3 never sent this gentleman a letter, because you 4 can't find his office, his office is closed. The 5 very first text that I ever sent him pertaining to 6 asking him to release me from the contract is 7 August 3rd. So he's saying that I fired him and he 8 was not able to pay the insulation, yet the very 9 first mention of me asking to get out of my 10 contract was over a month later. 11 MR. DAVIS: We're only going to take 12 conversation from the podium. 13 MR. SHOWEN: I just wanted to add that. I 14 mean, we could sit here all day. The gentleman is 15 lying, amongst many other things. 16 MR. DAVIS: Mr. Miranda, did you have any 17 other thing that you wanted to share concerning the 18 statement of Mr. Showen? 19 MR. MIRANDA: Yes, the insulation was 20 installed, okay, and we -- you know, we have time 21 to pay Gale Insulation. Okay? We don't have to 22 pay them the next day, but we -- like I said, I had 23 talked to Mr. Showen and we were fired from the 24 job. So if you're going to take -- you're going to 25 suspend my license because he fired me from the Page 90 1 job, okay, I don't think that's right. Okay? 2 Second of all, the bank would withdraw, if I called 3 them, and of course and you've heard that they will 4 not release the money to me. So if you're going to 5 suspend my license, I was fired. Okay? I've 6 stayed within my contract. I have not called in 7 for the bank draw because I was fired, and if I did 8 call it in and they went out there for inspection, 9 they would not release it. So now the liens would 10 be filed anyway. Now, if the bank went out and 11 released that money, those liens could be paid. 12 There would be nothing, that property would be 13 clean, ready to go, for the next step of stucco and 14 drywall. So if you guys are going to suspend my 15 license because he fired me and I didn't get the 16 money from the bank, I truly don't think that's 17 correct. 18 MR. DAVIS: Okay. Thank you. All right. Any 19 other discussion of the Board? All right. Did we 20 receive a motion? I'm sorry? We did not. Okay. 21 I know that I cut Mr. Leonard off and I apologize, 22 Mr. Leonard. I would now ask for a motion. 23 MR. ZRALLACK: Motion to approve staff's 24 recommendation with additional instruction to staff 25 to further investigate if additional alleged b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) 25 (Pages 91 to 93) Page 91 1 violations exist in the case. 2 MR. PARKER: Second. 3 MR. DAVIS: Okay. Was that a motion by 4 Mr. Zrallack? Was the second by Mr. Parker? Yeah. 5 A motion and second. Any discussion? 6 MR. HUDSPETH: So we're just specifically 7 talking about just 180 days suspension at this time 8 and then looking into further allegations or 9 information to be investigated; is that correct? 10 MR. DAVIS: Yes. Any other questions or 11 discussion? All right. Madam Secretary, if you 12 would take a voice vote, please. 13 MS. JOHNSON: Doug Davis? 14 MR. DAVIS: Yes, ma'am. 15 MS. JOHNSON: Roger Hudspeth? 16 MR. HUDSPETH: Yes, ma'am. 17 MS. JOHNSON: Chris Langel? 18 MR. LANGEL: Yes, ma'am. 19 MS. JOHNSON: Tony Jerger? 20 MR. JERGER: Yes, ma'am. 21 MS. JOHNSON: Travis Leonard? 22 MR. LEONARD: Yes, ma'am. 23 MS. JOHNSON: Michael Pride? 24 MR. PRIDE: Yes, ma'am. 25 MS. JOHNSON: Dan Zrallack? Page 92 1 MR. ZRALLACK: Yes, ma'am. 2 MS. JOHNSON: Dennis Parker? 3 MR. PARKER: Yes, ma'am. 4 MR. DAVIS: All right. That was unanimous for 5 a suspension of licensure in St. Lucie County with 6 further review and bringing this back to the Board. 7 I appreciate everybody. Thank you for being here, 8 Mr. Miranda. I appreciate that very much. It 9 didn't go in your favor this morning but I always 10 admire somebody that's willing to be here and speak 11 in a great opposition. Hopefully, there can be 12 some cleaning up of the issues, but as of right now 13 there is a suspension that's now been set upon your 14 license and we will hear more if there is more to 15 uncover and discuss at our next meeting. Okay? We 16 have two other items on our agenda, which both of 17 this may be hollow. One is old business and one is 18 new business. So is there any old business before 19 the Board that we need to bring up this morning? 20 Hearing none. Is there any new business? All 21 right. I call this meeting adjourned. Appreciate 22 everybody's time and effort this morning. 23 (The meeting was adjourned.) 24 25 Page 93 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 b83fc5a9-5b97-4e7b-be0d-06800b403260Electronically signed by Bradley Zebrowski (001-420-659-0485) Page 94 1 CERTIFICATE OF REPORTER 2 3 STATE OF FLORIDA ) 4 COUNTY OF ST. LUCIE ) 5 6 I, Bradley Zebrowski, Court Reporter, do hereby 7 certify that I was authorized to and did transcribe the 8 foregoing proceedings from an audio CD; and that the 9 transcription from the audio, pages 1 through 94, is a 10 true record of my stenographic notes to the best of my 11 ability. 12 13 DATED this 28th day of October, 2019. 14 15 16 17 _____________________________________ 18 Bradley Zebrowski, Court Reporter 19 20 21 22 23 24 25