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HomeMy WebLinkAboutMinutes 04-18-2008 CITIZENS’ BUDGET COMMITTEE Meeting Date: April 18, 2008 Conference Room 3 Meeting convened at 7:30 a.m. MEMBERS PRESENT: Carl Hensley, Chairman Jeremiah Johnson Edward Lounds Craig Mundt Nathaniel “Nate” Wells Bill Casey Chris Dzadovsky Michael McKinnon Barry Schrader Jay L. McBee Steven Messer Randy Ezell Patricia “Pat” Ferrick Thomas Hickey MEMBERS ABSENT: Richard Pancoast OTHERS PRESENT: Doug Anderson Faye Outlaw Lee Ann Lowery Marie Gouin Jennifer Hill Kathryn Hensley Erick Gill Mark Godwin Mike Monahan Beth Ryder Paul Hiott Stefanie Myers Jeff Furst Paul Hiott John Ferrick Carl Holeva Garry Wilson Michelle Franklin Bill Hammer Pat Curto-Nyman Lisa Savage Patricia Clute Citizens’ Budget Committee April 18, 2008 Page 2 Eva O’Donnell Marianne Arbore CALL TO ORDER Mr. Hensley called the meeting to order. Mr. Lounds apologized to Mr. Anderson, Mr. Casey and the Committee for what he said at the last meeting. He complimented the staff on the job they do. He was frustrated. He said Mr. Anderson does a great job and will be missed. APPROVAL OF MINUTES Mr. Casey made a motion to accept the February 15, 2008 minutes. It was seconded and approved unanimously. Mr. Lounds made a motion to approve the April 4, 2008 minutes. It was seconded and unanimously approved by the Committee. Mr. Lounds asked about payments from FEMA. Mr. Anderson explained that projects must be completed for payment. For example, the Special Needs Shelter should be completed in August. The reimbursement for debris pickup is still in process. The Federal government has recommended to the State that they repay $500,000. FEMA is reevaluating their position. They still owe $1,500,000. They are changing their policy. Ms. Outlaw added that at the completion of the permanent loans we would be eligible to get that money back. Mr. Lounds asked if the State takes a portion. He was answered that they don’t. OVERVIEW – DOUG ANDERSON Mr. Anderson asked the members to review the history of the amounts given to the Outside Agencies and the 2008-2009 amounts requested on the sheet attached. The Board of County Commissioners (BOCC) has requested the total amount be reduced by 10%. Mr. Hensley asked how the Committee would like to handle the discussion and recommendation. Mr. Mundt asked if there were options other than cutting these agencies. Mr. Anderson presented the St. Lucie County Budget Fact “or” Fiction PowerPoint attached. Mr. Mundt asked if Mr. Anderson expected any increase in wages. Mr. Anderson answered that he is not able to go into detail because of negotiations with the union in May. Citizens’ Budget Committee April 18, 2008 Page 3 Mr. Mundt asked for the total salary payments. Mrs. Gouin estimated $74 million. Mr. Anderson added that the number would be cut because employees are going to be laid off and the remaining will be expected to do a lot of things they had not done in the past. There will not be increases in benefits. They will look at wages again October 1, 2010. Mr. Lounds asked about unfunded mandates. The tax bill includes the School Board, South Florida Water Management and others. If the unfunded mandates were not included under St. Lucie County they would be somewhere else. The tax bill would still be up. Mr. Anderson feels things could be done differently at the State level. No increase is shown in the Sheriff’s budget. Every county department is down. Chief Deputy Wilson said there could be as many as 75 laid off from the Sheriff’s Office. Mr. Anderson said there are 168 BOCC qualified for early retirement. How many take that will determine how many are laid off in May and July. Mr. Furst explained that Property Appraiser, Tax Collector and the Clerk’s Office generate millions of dollars of revenue. It would not be revenue positive if you were rid of them. Most of the money goes to the Sheriff’s Office and as a citizen; protection is at the top of his list of reasons to pay taxes. Mr. Casey asked about increasing the amount paid by employees for dependents for insurance. Mr. Anderson explained the costs for users have gone up and the amount deducted from the paycheck has increased. Mr. Holeva gave the amounts of the increase. Mr. Anderson added that the employee’s part is more when they visit a physician. Mr. Casey said that in the private sector people are paying $600 to $700 per month. Mr. Anderson explained that only one item could be opened in the union contract and it will be wages this time. Mr. Casey asked how many union employees there are of the 834 County employees. Almost half are union; and you cannot treat groups differently. Mr. Casey asked if the sex offenders pay any part of their registration cost. Chief Deputy Wilson answered that originally the State said no; but there is a bill to change that in process. Mr. Casey asked about Violation of Probation (VOP). Chief Deputy Wilson explained the situation and informed the group that last month the VOP population was over 500. It is a financial burden. If there were 250 in each of 67 counties, it would be a huge savings for the State. Mr. Anderson added that if someone is sentenced to one year and one day they go to a State prison. They are talking about changing that to 18 months. Citizens’ Budget Committee April 18, 2008 Page 4 Mr. Casey asked about the Skateboard Park being an enterprise operation. RFPs have been issued per Mr. Anderson. Mr. Casey asked if there would be advertisement for the auction. He feels the vehicles would bring more money if more people bid. Mr. Casey started discussion on layoffs and asked about overtime. Mr. Anderson answered that the County is being dismantled quickly. Overtime has been cut back and there will not be temporary staff if someone has an illness. County agencies may be closed if someone is ill. Mr. Casey asked about reductions in the Constitutional Offices’ budgets. Mr. Anderson answered that the Sheriff’s budget has been frozen. The others are not due until May 1. Chief Deputy Wilson said their staff has been going down since last budget year. They are not replacing anyone that retires or is fired. Ms. Ferrick asked how many of the 168 employees would be laid off if they do not take the early retirement. Mr. Holeva answered that 54 were identified. Ms. Ferrick asked how they would survive without insurance and pay. Mr. Anderson said he can relate to the situation but there is nothing we can do. The County does not have the money to pay. She asked if there would be more than 54 laid off. Mr. Anderson does not know how many more than 54 until he has information on the property tax reform and property values in June. Ms. Ferrick started discussion on the employees having insurance if they left. Mr. Anderson ended the discussion by saying the voters of St. Lucie County wanted this. Ms. Ferrick asked how much of the unfunded mandates were for the Constitutional Offices. About 70% of the $95 million was the answer. She thinks it should be explained when people are campaigning. Mr. Anderson said the County’s spending is right in line with the CPI increase and growth. Ms. Ferrick asked the estimated number of employees Mr. Anderson expects to have after layoffs. He is not able to determine that number until he knows who takes early retirement, the final property values and the property tax reform effect. We will be down over 200 employees. Ms. Ferrick asked about the population projection. Mr. Anderson said they used the median number and they are not expecting new construction. Mr. Mundt went back to his original question, if there was $200,000 anywhere else in the budget. Mr. Anderson answered that he has cut the County departments’ budgets by more than 10% and could not give anyone else more. Our Community Services Department and Citizens’ Budget Committee April 18, 2008 Page 5 libraries serve the public, and they have been cut. Mr. Lounds asked about the judicial agencies’ budgets. Ms. Gouin responded that their budgets have not been analyzed. There will be a meeting of the four counties to discuss the plan. He asked if they expect to be cut 10-12%. Ms. Gouin answered that some of them have different funding. He asked about the County’s portion of their budgets. It was pointed out as part of the PowerPoint presentation. Mr. Lounds hopes that the Committee does not cut a dime that costs a dollar. The Committee needs to look at the effect. If a system that helps the Mental Health program is not funded, we pay on the other end. He feels the folks on the Committee are smart enough to balance the cuts. He wants the Committee to help Mr. Anderson look outside the box. Mr. Anderson said he would be bringing things to the Committee to review over the next few months. He needs the Committee’s input and support. Mr. Lounds suggested asking people in the community that are not on the Committee for help. It would educate the others. Mr. Anderson brought up the issue of School Resource Officers. Mr. Hensley suggested inviting the groups that attended the meetings last fall to come again. Mr. Lounds said the youthful offenders that need mental health care would cost a lot more if they were taken to the jail instead of New Horizons. Mr. Anderson asked Mr. Godwin to give a report on the Juvenile Assessment Center (JAC). Mr. Godwin said the House and Senate are looking at eliminating the JAC. It is located next to the Juvenile Detention Center, which costs the County $184 per day per child. They are working with the judges to reduce the time children spend there. In a meeting in Tallahassee two weeks ago, Mr. Godwin was told that since the utilization time went down, they are increasing the cost. The JAC frees up law enforcement time. Mr. Godwin used the example of when his house was burned down years ago by a child who should have been in school, to show the value of deputies being able to take children to the JAC. The State called to say the JAC would be closed in 48 hours unless the County could fund it. Money not used by Sentencing Alternatives was used to keep it open. Mr. Lounds said keeping the lights on at the sports fields keeps the kids out of gangs. Mr. Anderson said he understands and is trying. He gave the example of waterproofing the buildings. We are trying to maintain what we have the best we can. Mr. Lounds asked him to let the Committee help to manage some of the thoughts. He asked the others to use volunteer groups. Mr. Anderson added that $121 million of unbudgeted expenses were paid after the 2004 hurricanes. Mr. Lounds made a motion that the County not fund Executive Roundtable and 2-1-1 and split that money evenly among the other groups. Mr. Wells seconded the motion. Mr. Citizens’ Budget Committee April 18, 2008 Page 6 Lounds explained that he thinks those two would be easier to cover. There would be more calls to 9-1-1. He would like the churches to help with the homeless situation. Mr. Dzadovsky commented that the taxpayers mandated the cuts. The Committee represents the citizens and they said they want the government run better. He feels everybody should share the pain. In private business, when the money is taken away, they adjust and find a way. He feels we should move toward a shared pain. A wise sage said, “The only way to stop government spending, is to take away the money.” As the leader of a non-profit, he lost 80% of the funding. He was able to focus on revenues and reorganize. They came out in the best financial shape because they made the hard choices. He was with an airline that went through two bankruptcies. It was tough, but they survived. Mr. Lounds made a motion to start discussion. Mr. McBee left the meeting at 8:35. Ms. Ferrick asked about the effect of matching funds. These agencies help the part of society that is suffering now. If we don’t fund these up front, we’ll pay on the back end. She read the questions and was satisfied with the answers about travel, telephone systems and cell phones. Mr. Anderson explained the County policy on cell phones. Mr. Casey agreed with Mr. Dzadovsky that each agency knows their finances and should be the ones to make the tough decisions about what should be cut. Mr. Dzadovsky didn’t feel the agencies answered the questions about the revenue side. He gave the example of someone who could afford it, paying for a flu shot. The agencies will be able to prioritize. The administrative side is usually heavy and the service side is not as well funded. Agencies will be able to look at and reduce administration and still be able to maintain the services. Mr. Wells said the Executive Roundtable is a group of executives and they would be able to find a way even though it won’t be easy. There is a phrase in Economics 101 that the voters will vote for what they think will benefit them but often find out it doesn’t. They voted to cut the sources to the people who need it the most. He has 20-30 gang members on his street every afternoon. He doesn’t see members of the Executive Roundtable there. The gang members don’t like him; but he is not moving away. They need support. They need guidance on how to work. They are not making it in school. They need attention. Mr. Dzadovsky agrees that it is difficult and emotional. There was discussion on public safety, perceived crime, and the citizens’ demand. Mr. Casey asked about the Council on Aging increase. Ms. Ryder explained that is the amount of their federal match and the services they provide. Citizens’ Budget Committee April 18, 2008 Page 7 Mr. Mundt asked for clarification on the amounts. Mr. Lounds explained. Mr. Hensley reminded the Committee of the function of the Executive Roundtable. Mr. Furst gave his opinion on Mr. Anderson’s job versus the Committee’s job. Mr. Anderson does not have a choice. The Committee and Commissioners do. Some of the agencies do not have a place to go and the public will suffer. Mr. Johnson asked for clarification. Mr. Lounds feels these two agencies would be better able to get their job done without the County money. There was a roll call vote with five for and eight against. Mr. Lounds made a motion to reduce each agency 10%. Mr. Dzadovsky seconded the motion. Mr. Casey commented that it is not a true 10% cut. Ms. Ryder explained the transit numbers should not be in there. The motion was amended and seconded to reflect the correct figure. There was a roll call vote with ten for and three against. Mr. Lounds asked Mr. Anderson and staff to let them help find ways to provide services even though the budget has been cut. Mr. Anderson said if the Committee would like to meet more often, he would accommodate. Mr. Lounds doesn’t think that is the answer. He thinks more people need to be involved. OTHER ISSUES Mr. Dzadovsky said he had heard all morning that there is a problem with the State. He thinks the Committee should send a letter to the Legislature or the Governor. They should check with other Counties to see if they have Citizens’ Budget Committee. Mr. Hensley feels the Legislature knows exactly what they are doing. Mr. Dzadovsky suggested a public forum to let the taxpayers know. Mr. Anderson wondered how many other counties have a Citizens’ Budget Committee and volunteered to do a survey to get that information. Mr. Lounds agreed it was important to influence the folks in Tallahassee; but the immediate need is to support the local government in finding ways to manage the money. He asked the members to stay with it and support the administration. Mr. Hammer made his observations and asked that his comments be attached to the Citizens’ Budget Committee April 18, 2008 Page 8 minutes. Ms. Hensley feels the voters were misled for political reasons. The repercussions are phenomenal. It will dismantle local governments. If the local government does not follow State direction the repercussions are immediate. If the State government chooses not to enact any part of the Constitution, it is a lawsuit that takes up to eight years and since we have term limits, there is no repercussion for the current officials to follow their own laws. Mr. Hensley expressed his appreciate for each person’s time and asked them to keep working. ADJOURNMENT Mr. Hensley adjourned the meeting at 8:58 a.m. Respectfully submitted by: Brenda Marlin The next CBC regular meeting will be held on Friday, May 16, 2008, at 7:30 a.m., in Conference Room #3, at the St. Lucie County Roger Poitras Administration Annex.