HomeMy WebLinkAboutMinutes 03-13-2009
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ST. LUCIE COUNTY
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SMART GROWTH ADVISORY AD HOC COMMITTEE
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ST. LUCIE COUNTY, FLORIDA
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2300 Virginia Avenue
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Growth Management Department
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Conference Room One
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March 13, 2009, 10:00 A.M.
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A compact disc recording of this meeting, in its entirety, has been placed in the file along with these
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minutes as part of the record. In the event of a conflict between the written summary minutes and the
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compact disc, the compact disc shall control.
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CALL TO ORDER
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Chairman Trias called the meeting to order at 10:09 A.M.
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ROLL CALL
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Ramon Trias ..................................... Chairman
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David Kelly........................................ Committee Member
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Patricia A. Ferrick ............................. Committee Member
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Rick Reikenis .................................... Committee Member
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Mary Chapman ................................. Vice-Chair
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Noreen S. Dreyer .............................. Committee Member
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Sam Comer ...................................... Committee Member
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Larry Storms ..................................... Committee Member
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MEMBERS ABSENT:
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Michael Houston ............................... Committee Member
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Marty Sanders ................................. Committee Member
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STAFF PRESENT
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Kara Wood…………………………Planning Manager
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Britton Wilson ……………………. Senior Planner
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Heather Young…………………… Assistant County Attorney
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OTHERS IN ATTENDANCE
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None
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1.Review the minutes from the February 12 and February 27, 2009 meetings for
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approval.
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Mr. Trias called for discussion of the February 12 and February 27 meeting minutes. There
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were no recommend corrections to the minutes. A motion to approve the minutes as is was
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made by Mr. Trias and Seconded by Mr. Kelly; both sets of minutes were approved
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unanimously.
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2.Staff Updates
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Ms. Wood stated that the Assistant Director of Growth Management has determined that staff
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will no longer transcribe minutes for meetings that do not have a quorum; however, the
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meetings will still be recorded for future references.
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Ms. Young stated that we still need to provide at the minimum an outline of the meeting
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documenting who was present and that there was no quorum.
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Mr. Trias stated that he thinks it is important to have minutes in written form and that
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anytime there is a discussion of something meaningful there needs to be minutes. He
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also stated that it is not the same to have a recorded CD as to have a summary that has
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the substance of the discussion.
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Ms. Ferrick agreed with Mr. Trias. She stated that even though there was not a quorum
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last meeting; what was addressed during last meeting was very beneficial and that she
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would be very disappointed if there were no minutes from the meeting. She also felt that
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if minutes were not going to be done when a quorum is not met than the committee
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should not meet at that time.
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Mr. Trias agreed if minutes are not going to be taken when there is no quorum then there
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should not be a meeting. He also stated that he is concerned that staff at the
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management level doesn’t seem to understand that taking minutes is very important and
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that he will continue to stress the issue to who ever he needs to.
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Ms. Wood stated that she doesn’t disagree that the minutes are important, but that it is
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difficult for committee members to vote on minutes if they were not present at the
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meeting and that there is a problem with approving the minutes and taking action when
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there is no quorum.
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Ms. Young stated that members can vote on minutes if they were not in attendance at the
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previous meeting, there is a quorum doing the vote, and if the committee member does
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not have a conflict with voting for the minutes. She also asked the question if the
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committee would still like to meet if there is no quorum.
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Ms. Chapman stated that if there is no quorum that it is better to have the meeting
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anyway. She is not completely for just not having a meeting, because people lose
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interest and a lot of detail can be worked through during the discussion although there is
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no quorum.
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Mr. Trias made the point that he understands that a quorum needs to be met if actions
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are taken, but when you are brainstorming and coming up with suggestions and the
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discussion is important, minutes need to be transcribed.
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Ms. Wood agreed that minutes are important and there is a choice on how the committee
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wants to address the issue being that staff has been given the direction from the Growth
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Management Assistant Director not to transcribe minutes when there is not a quorum.
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Mr. Trias stated that he would be happy to talk to Faye Outlaw about it and that may be
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the committee will request that that is not the policy.
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Mr. Kelly asked if Ms. Wood would take the discussion of the minutes back to the
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Assistant Director.
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Ms. Wood clarified the committee’s position on the policy for taking minutes:
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1. The committee still wants to meet if there is no quorum.
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2. If there is no quorum summary minutes should still be provided.
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Mr. Kelly pointed out that (if only two or three members are present then there should not
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be a meeting) good judgment should be used regarding whether or not a meeting should
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take place.
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Ms. Dreyer asked that a longer response time be given for a quorum call.
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Ms. Chapman made the suggestion that during a discussion the transcriber of the
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minutes could say a discussion ensued and state the topic.
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Mr. Trias ended the discussion by saying that if the committee wants to talk about
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recommendations the minutes need to be in writing in a summarized fashion in order to
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be able to send them to other people.
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3.Discussion items.
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A. Review of draft recommendations-revised and consider draft recommendations-
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alternate.
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Mr. Trias opened the discussion of the draft recommendations.
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Ms. Dreyer stated that she felt that the draft recommendations were very good; however,
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she suggested that they be reduced future.
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Density should be a part of the Urban Form section
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Fewer/more condensed transportation recommendations
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Less detail in general (Executive Summary / Matrix)
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Change formatting of any editorial comments regarding each
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recommendation to make a clearer distinction between the two different
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pieces of text
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Ms. Dreyer also wanted to ensure that when recommendations were brought before the
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Commission clear suggestions were made and that the Commissionerss didn’t have to
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make determinations on criteria that the committee should have already presented in a
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clear and concise manor.
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Mr. Trias asked Ms. Dreyer to give her comments to Ms. Wood.
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Mr. Comer agreed that the draft recommendations should be simplified wherever
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possible.
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Ms. Dreyer also mentioned her recommendations regarding making provisions to the
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Comprehensive Plan and Zoning regulations that encourage a wide range of housing
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types rather than requiring a PUD.
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Ms. Wood stated that she condensed the housing and parking recommendations under
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Urban Form based on committee comments to condense three specific elements which
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include housing, parking and density and that if Ms. Dreyer wanted to expand on the
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housing element to make it boarder she could. However, Ms. Wood also stated that she
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felt like the density element was more of a policy related issue which didn’t have anything
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to do with form.
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Mr. Trias mentioned that density was an issue that needed to be looked act when
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incorporating it in the Urban Form section.
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The discussion continued with the committee commenting on the formatting of the
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document as brought up by Ms. Dreyer as listed above.
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Ms. Chapman agreed with using an executive summary.
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Mr. Trias suggested that use of the matrix included in the recommendations memo by
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Ms. Wood was also be a good way to present the recommendations to the Board.
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Ms. Ferrick continued the conversation with comments regarding water quality
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regulations that prohibit development within, and the filling of, floodways and floodplains.
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She feels that the section on Water Quality should not be deleted entirely and that
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updates to the Comprehensive Plan and Land Development Code need to be made to
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comply with state mandates.
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Mr. Trias agreed with Ms. Ferrick’s comments. In addition, he also feels that other ways
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such as stemwall construction to prevent flooding and achieve elevation should be
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provided and that if anyone feels strongly about certain issues they should be reflected in
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the recommendations brought to the BOCC.
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After Mr. Trias’ comments a discussion ensued about how much detail should be
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reflected in the committee’s recommendations to the Board and whether comments being
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addressed by other committees needed to be mentioned in the Smart Growth
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Committee’s recommendation.
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Ms. Wood suggested that Water Quality, (the requirement to build in areas above the
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floodplain, etc.) could be referenced under the Direction of Growth section and that fill
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and stemwall construction requirements could be listed under the Urban Form section.
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Mr. Trias asked for other comments or issues that should be addressed in the
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memorandum.
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Mr. Reikenis addressed concerns regarding mass, density and drainage from the LEED
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(Leadership in Energy Environmental Design) certification process/perspective. In his
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comments he stated that you don’t want to create density at the cost of having poor
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drainage because the implementation of Smart Growth at the expense of building in
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floodplains would not be so smart.
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Ms. Wood asked Mr. Reikenis for LEED specific references that would fit in the category
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to be included in the recommendations.
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Ms. Dreyer expressed her concern regarding the how to’s and appropriate
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implementation of elevation into the committees recommendations.
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Mr. Storms made a suggestion to implement these issues in the matrix under the LCD
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Issues section by adding another category that says site design is important including
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floodplains, the coordination between disciplines, etc. so that it’s current, trackable and
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complies with the updated code.
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Mr. Trias stated that LEED sets the standards for using multi-disciplinary collaboration
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during site design.
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Mr. Storms made further suggestion that the reference to LEED also be placed in the
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LDC section of the matrix.
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Ms. Ferrick asked that these issues be reflected in the minutes and would like to see all
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of the comments put on paper for vote at the next meeting.
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Ms. Wood confirmed Committee’s direction on revisions to the recommendation
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documents to include:
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Re-work matrix as an Executive Summary of recommendations
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Continue to revise draft recommendations based on today’s discussions
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Incorporate some language from LEED requirements as a reference for
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specific areas. Certification for New Construction and Renovation of
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Existing Buildings are criteria that have been clearly set; LEED ND is still
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under construction but may provide useful direction.
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The Committee confirmed Ms. Wood’s summary of the recommendations.
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Mr. Comer asked if the committee should put a greater emphasis on LEED qualifications
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and at some point mandate LEED principles.
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Ms. Dreyer suggested that the LEED principles be encouraged, but not mandated.
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B. Next steps in Smart Growth recommendations content and formatting.
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Ms. Ferrick asked who controls the LEED conditions and how fast do they change.
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Mr. Reikenis stated that the US Green Building Council controls it. He also gave a brief
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explanation about the qualifications for LEED certification by providing a summary and
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listing of LEED programs and different areas where points can be accumulated.
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Mr Reikenis also brought up the question as to why would we “reinvent the wheel” by
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continuing to debate Smart Growth when we can just require LEED certification? He
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feels that with in the next 10 years developers will be practicing LEED principles as a
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matter of course.
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Ms. Chapman’s concern was that whoever is creating the LEED principles could really
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cause havoc in the development industry.
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Mr. Reikenis ensured Ms. Chapman that the principles for LEED certification which
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require the accumulation of 26 points are already set and that how they are obtained is
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up to the developer. He also gave an example of how in some instances LEED
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certification couldn’t be met but, instead Florida Green Building Certification was
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acquired.
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Ms. Ferrick made a suggestion to incorporate FGBC/LEED as requirement or incentive in
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the Smart Growth recommendations.
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From MS. Ferrick’s statement a discussion ensued about the types of incentives to be
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used for compliance with FGBC/LEED certification.
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Ms. Dreyer made a suggestion about using concurrency as an incentive.
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Mr. Kelly stated that a (traffic) concurrency incentive may be most effective to encourage
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LEED development.
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Ms. Dreyer suggested the use of parks concurrency would also be a good incentive.
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Mr. Trias stated that he believes the best incentive is to create clear land development
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regulations such as what has been done in the TVC. He goes on to say that he feels the
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TVC is a good example of what is trying to be accomplished through the Smart Growth
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process.
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Mr. Trias opened up a new conversation to discuss the revision of the committee’s
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recommendations for next meeting. He stated that he hopes that this will finalize at least
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one of the documents to take to the Board of County Commissioners.
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Ms. Chapman asked what is the format and venue for presenting recommendations to a
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BOCC (Workshop, Informal, or Regular) meeting.
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The Committee agreed that it should be presented at the next informal meeting.
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Ms. Chapman suggested that the document be sent out to the Board members to say
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that the Smart Growth committee will be presenting their recommendations formally at
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the informal meeting, so that it would then be ready to go to a regular meeting.
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Ms. Young suggested that backup material be provided and that it could possibly be put
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on the BOCC Informal meeting for April.
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Mr. Trias asked that the meeting be scheduled for the April informal BOCC meeting for
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discussion and feedback.
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The Committee agreed.
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Ms. Wood stated that she will check with the GM Director and with Administration to see
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if this can be placed on the April Informal BOCC agenda.
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4. Other Business
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Mr. Kelly gave an update regarding the status of his suggested revisions to the current
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LDC. He summarized sections of the code that would need to be considered; most
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changes would be in Chapter 7.
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Mr. Trias asked that a memo / summary of the suggested revisions to current LDC be
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made available at next committee meeting and at the April Informal BOCC meeting.
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Mr. Kelly asked the committee for additional comments/ concerns regarding the LDC.
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Ms. Ferrick addressed Ordinance 06-047, referencing the need to address drainage and
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floodplain issues. She stated that ordinance 06-047 had not been incorporated in the
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LDC code.
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Ms. Wood explained that the Ordinance is adopted as part of the LDC, but that copies of
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the code have not been maintained in the past. She also stated that the County has
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contracted with Municipal Code Corporation (Municode) to maintain our Land
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Development Code, post it on the Municode website and bring all of the language that
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has not been incorporated together as one code book.
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Mr. Trias mentioned that the Next meeting date of Friday, March 27, 2009. He also asked for
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any additional comments.
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Mr. Dreyer stated that she liked have the date of the next meeting on the agenda.
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The meeting adjourned at 11:13 AM
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